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A Mechanic's Life - Tales From Under the Hood

2788 messages,  Last post on May 18, 2013 at 11:15 PM

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Messages Page 171 of 279

#1700 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [thecardoc3] by steve_ HOST

Feb 24, 2013 (8:04 pm)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Feb 23, 2013 4:01 am)
I'm going to give this a 75% chance that he got ripped off by the system.
 
After reading this story in the NY Times tonight, I wonder if your estimate is too low (GM "brake lines are so susceptible to rust they may burst").
 
The oil myth quote goes "If the oil turns dark or black quickly, it's no good. You can tell the condition of oil by the look, smell or color of it. Dirty (black) motor oil means the oil is breaking down".
 
(Big tool sale tonight only at Sears btw).

#1701 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [steve_] by thecardoc3

Feb 25, 2013 (4:24 am)

Replying to: steve_ (Feb 24, 2013 8:04 pm)
The oil myth quote goes "If the oil turns dark or black quickly, it's no good. You can tell the condition of oil by the look, smell or color of it. Dirty (black) motor oil means the oil is breaking down".
 
From your quote.
 
A common misconception is that high quality motor oil should come out of an engine looking clean at the time of an oil change. Nothing could be further from the truth. If the oil is doing its job of cleaning the engine, then it should be dirty when it is drained
 
People read that, and would look at the oil that was still in my Mustang and with no other information think that it was OK to keep running it. The mileage that we put on the car last year was 80% highway miles with one way trips of fifty or more miles. We rode 500 yesterday, and are in Bowling Green Ky. this morning. After touring the Corvette factory and museum today, we will be headed on to Memphis.
 
After reading this story in the NY Times tonight, I wonder if your estimate is too low (GM "brake lines are so susceptible to rust they may burst").
 
First this isn't a problem with just GM vehicles. Honda, Ford, Chrysler and others all also have brake line corrosion concerns. The lines are fine and probably last the lifetime of the car if you aren't in the rust belt like we are. I have some cars that before we went to the copper-nickle alloy have had some pieces of line replaced more han once. Even the coated lines you can find at the parts stores don 't last. I have one truck that the owner asked me to not only use coated lines, we rust proofed every inch of the lines that I installed. That worked, so far...
 
In Pa. we still have state inspections. At one time techs could fail a car if the lines looked bad enough, today we can only fail them if they are leaking, and what happens later that day isn't our problem. On one hand that may seem like it doesn't make any sense, but if we are to fail the lines by what they look like (judgment call) then we can get it wrong both ways and can be held responsible. Think about it, we could condemn a line, only to have it last another year or more, (we would be rip-offs selling unneccesary work) and we could not condemn that same line only to have it fail later that day (now we are incompetent, or must have done something to the line to make it fail). The facts are, you just cannot tell by looking at them. The best we can do is show the customer, and tell them they need to plan on dealing with them, but we are not allowed to fail them. As watered down as the state inspection program has gotten to be, I wouldn't be surprised if it eventually goes away completely in the near future.
 
Some of the notable experiences are lines that have failed while we had a customers vehicle in for another repair. One was a Ford truck with a powerstroke diesel driveability problem. I was doing my baseline tests, which included an automated test that requires me to hold the vehicle with the brakes and a line burst in the shop. I was moments from going out on the road with the truck. That's one of those "I got good news, and I got bad news phone calls" for that customer. The bad news is of course that the line failed, the good news is that they didn't experience the loss of the brakes themselves. With me behind the wheel, its my insurance if an accident had actually occurred, but its also my driving skills and attention to detail that are tested to try and prevent an accident. No one has ever questioned needing the lines replaced and usually feel bad that their car put me in that position. To me its just part of the job, and I feel better knowing that my customer didn't have that frightening experience.

#1702 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [steve_] by thecardoc3

Feb 25, 2013 (4:28 am)

Replying to: steve_ (Feb 24, 2013 8:04 pm)
After reading this story in the NY Times tonight, I wonder if your estimate is too low (GM "brake lines are so susceptible to rust they may burst").
 
BTW. GM and Chrysler both had so many tranny line problems, they sell factory bent replacements cheaper than I can make new lines from bulk.
Don't forget fuel lines in this too. You should see what it might take to do a simple fuel filter replacement, you could get into doing every brake and fuel line on a car as they fail the moment they are disturbed.

#1703 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [thecardoc3] by steve_ HOST

Feb 25, 2013 (6:41 am)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Feb 25, 2013 4:24 am)
Well, you know what they say, "Just because an oil isn't light, it doesn't mean that it is safe to continue to run in your engine."
 
I've never lived in the rust belt until we moved to the UP three winters ago. The amount of road salt they use up here is just amazing, compared to my AK experience at least. It took ~15 years before I had to start rattle-canning the lower door areas of my Tercel up there. My Idaho rides were old but pretty pristine after the decade in Boise but they are rusting now.
 
Pennsylvania likes to tout their auto inspections and toss out stats about how much safer the cars are there. I have my doubts, but I'm not surprised to hear that the program may go away. People tend to hate those inspection programs.

#1704 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [steve_] by thecardoc3

Feb 25, 2013 (6:45 am)

Replying to: steve_ (Feb 24, 2013 8:04 pm)
Big tool sale tonight only at Sears btw
 
Did you know that Craftsman tools that were bought with the full lifetime warranty aren't guaranteed anymore if I go to the store with my work shirt on? Of course I don't have and use many of them anymore,since my box has mostly Snap-On and Matco tools in it. The majority of the craftsman stuff that I do have has been taken home to use on the garden tractor and around the house. I still break one on occasion when I do use them. It doesn't seem right that they can discriminate against professional mechanics when it comes to the warranty.

#1705 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [thecardoc3] by steve_ HOST

Feb 25, 2013 (7:03 am)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Feb 25, 2013 6:45 am)
Guess they don't want their tools to be "used" but yeah, I have seen a lot of products disclaim the warranty for professional or commercial use. Most recently the in-laws' electric blanket (not for motel use).
 
Sears should rename the sets to Wannabe Mechanic's Tool Kits.

#1706 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [steve_] by thecardoc3

Feb 25, 2013 (7:02 am)

Replying to: steve_ (Feb 25, 2013 6:41 am)
Pennsylvania likes to tout their auto inspections and toss out stats about how much safer the cars are there. I have my doubts, but I'm not surprised to hear that the program may go away. People tend to hate those inspection programs.
 
Safer cars, safer roads
 
There is only a little pressure to kill the program right now, however there is some activity to try and amend the emissions testing that we do. The emissions program is tied into the safety inspections in that, you cannot get a safety sticker until you satisfy the requirments of the emissions program. Sen Elder Vogel wants up to a ten year exemption on the emissions testing because in hs opinion there just aren't enough broken cars that it gets credit for being repaired. IMO all someone would have to do is add an amendment to that bill to kill the safety program and it will all fall in a hurry.
 
There is both good and bad in that, the bad side is that there are quite a number of shops who's existence relies on the inspection program. A lot of those won't be able to change direction fast enough to stay viable without it. They do a lot of good, and necessary repairs, but the loss of the program would have some customers putting some of these repairs off for a long period of time. That is until fate finally catches up with those vehicle owners. The shops would need to drastically cut expenses and IMO the shops don't have the cash reserves to wait out the lul in vehicle traffic. Then by the time the consumer does get forced by the car itself to have something done, we will have the classic situation where the repairs cost more than the value of the car and that will hurt them more at that point in time then all of the repairs strung out over a larger time period would have.

#1707 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [thecardoc3] by isellhondas

Feb 25, 2013 (10:53 am)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Feb 25, 2013 6:45 am)
So Sears is admitting that the wrenches and sockets that the sell aren't professional quality?
 
When I worked for Sears, they didn't do that.
 
Still, if people saw the abuse some tools take they wouldn't believe it.
 
The pros didn't want to hear the word "abuse" but so often it applied.

#1708 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [isellhondas] by Mr_Shiftright HOST

Feb 25, 2013 (11:18 am)

Replying to: isellhondas (Feb 25, 2013 10:53 am)
Sears is just admitting what every mechanic already knows.
 
You want to break every knuckle on your right hand? Just put a lot of torque on an open-end Craftsman wrench.

#1709 of 2788 Re: Just to clarify... [thecardoc3] by busiris

Feb 25, 2013 (12:57 pm)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Feb 25, 2013 4:24 am)
In Pa. we still have state inspections. At one time techs could fail a car if the lines looked bad enough, today we can only fail them if they are leaking, and what happens later that day isn't our problem. On one hand that may seem like it doesn't make any sense, but if we are to fail the lines by what they look like (judgment call) then we can get it wrong both ways and can be held responsible. Think about it, we could condemn a line, only to have it last another year or more, (we would be rip-offs selling unneccesary work) and we could not condemn that same line only to have it fail later that day (now we are incompetent, or must have done something to the line to make it fail). The facts are, you just cannot tell by looking at them. The best we can do is show the customer, and tell them they need to plan on dealing with them, but we are not allowed to fail them. As watered down as the state inspection program has gotten to be, I wouldn't be surprised if it eventually goes away completely in the near future.
 
Well, that's exactly what SC did several years ago. Annual car safety inspection was required, but the price was state-regulated, yet the state kept adding on inspection requirements. Finally, it became impossible to find any shop willing to spend the time to do an inspection, since they lost money on every single one.
 
That forced the state to do away with the inspections.

Messages Page 171 of 279

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