Last post on Nov 23, 2013 at 6:38 AM
You are in the Toyota Avalon
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Toyota Avalon, Toyota, Sedan
#565 of 716 Re: Avalon 2013 ride (CR reports?) [teresa01]
Jun 15, 2013 (1:27 pm)
My local tire dealer didn't have much very nice to say about the Bridgestones either. Then again he is a tire dealer selling tires. The Camry hybrid comes with the same exact Bridgestone tire as the Avalon hybrid and gets a better ride score than the Avalon. CR may have rated the old Avalon as having a nice pillow soft ride but they rated the emergency handling as poor. Toyota can't win with CR with this car.
#566 of 716 Toyota obviously signed their life away to Bridgestone
Jun 16, 2013 (8:57 pm)
Even the iconic Lexus LFA sported the ancient Bridgestone RE070 over clearly superior, and easily more modern, performance rubber currently available.
Bridgestone must have paid Toyota a small fortune for the account.
#567 of 716 Re: Avalon 2013 ride (CR reports?) [havec]
Jun 17, 2013 (3:35 am)
My local tire dealer didn't have much very nice to say about the Bridgestones either. Then again he is a tire dealer selling tires.
Personally, I don't think car tires are as noisy as some claim. Cabin noise comes from three major sources---engine noise, wind noise and tire noise. Automakers use quiet glass to eliminate wind noise and sound deadening materials, noise cancellation technology and insulation to block engine noise.
Unfortunately, these measures have made the cabin so whisper quiet that tire road noises sound louder than they really are. Tire noise is a matter of physics--the noise does not really come from the tire compound itself but rather from the air pockets created when the tire makes contact with the road surface. So you can waste your money switching to a different brand but the tire decibel level will not change appreciable.
#568 of 716 Re: Avalon 2013 ride (CR reports?) [bwia]
Jun 17, 2013 (3:45 am)
Oh, contra my friend. It can be and is as big an issue as some are making out of it.
In my case, I had to turn my radio up to 20+ on the volume to hear it, and not the tire noise:(
#569 of 716 Re: Avalon 2013 ride (CR reports?) [bwia]
Jun 17, 2013 (3:59 am)
Wow! You have come up with some interesting theories about perceived tire noises. I am 73yrs old and spent most of my life in the automobile service and repair business. I can assure you,I have identified and solved many a noisy tire problems in my time. Personal experience with awful tire noises from a set of new "Stones" was one of the worst examples I ever personal ever delt with. They where on a new Lexus I owned and getting them replaced with another set of tires transformed the car for the better in all respects. So with all due respect I strongly disagree with your hypothisis.
#570 of 716 Re: 2013 Avalon [poorthingflint]
Jun 17, 2013 (9:13 am)
Yes, that's a good product, and using it is a good idea. I would point out though, having had 4 of them, that the Lexus leather used is impervious to UV rays and other aging factors. It's amazing. I had a 96 ES up until last year, sat in the Nevada sun for 16 years, and the leather seats still looked, felt and functions just like new, with no treatment. - so while Meguires is awesome, that probably isn't the factor you may think.
#571 of 716 Re: 2013 Avalon [nvbanker]
Jun 17, 2013 (1:44 pm)
Thanks for your real world experience input. Perhaps I will be less diligent in my leather treatments but it makes me feel better even if the seats are not benefiting that much if any. Old habits die hard,but at least there is no evidence I have caused any problems by over maintaining my interiors and it makes the leather look better.
#572 of 716 Re: 2013 Avalon [poorthingflint]
Jun 19, 2013 (2:23 pm)
It certainly doesn't hurt them! Keep a polishing!!!
#573 of 716 Re: 17" vs 18" tires [teresa01]
Jun 29, 2013 (1:00 pm)
I have not been on this forum recently, but I noticed your post and thought I could provide my reply.
I did swap out the Bridgestone EL400's for a set of four Michelin Primacy MXM4 tires (P225/45R18) a few weeks ago. So, I now have had the chance to evaluate the ride of the 2013 Avalon for all four combinations of rim size and tire comparisons between Bridgestone and Michelin.
If you use a scale of 1 to 10, where 10 is the best, here are my observations:
17" rims with Michelin Primacy MXV4 tires (P215/55R17)..........Score = 9
18" rims with Michelin Primacy MXM4 tires (P225/45R18)..........Score = 7
17" rims with Bridgestone Turenza EL400-02 (P215/55R17).......Score = 4
18" rims with Bridgestone Turenza EL400-02 (P225/45R18).......Score = 4
Note that the Michelin tires are not identical; the MXV4 is a little more ride comfort oriented, while the MXM4 is a little more performance oriented. The MXV4 is quieter than the MXM4 at highway speeds over 50 mph, but the MXM4 is overall much quieter than the Bridgestone tires. The Michelin MXM4 takes the road bumps better than the Bridgestones. The MXV4 is not available in the 18" size.
The best possible ride for the 2013 Avalon appears to come from the combination of the 17" rims with the Michelin MXV4 Primacy tires. I would venture to say that the 2 point improvement in score from 7 to 9 comes 50% due to the larger sidewall and 50% due to the Primacy MXV4 vs. the MXM4 tire design.
Now that I'm riding on the MXM4's on the 18" rims, I would say the ride is OK. It is a reasonable compromise between handling and comfort. I liked the ride on the 17" rims with the MXV's more, but I don't care to spend $1500 to purchase 4 new Toyota 17" OEM rims. You would also need to have a competent mechanic transfer the four TPMS valves to the new rims as well, otherwise you're looking at over an additional $400 for four Toyota OEM TPMS units. My current thinking is to ride the Avalon with the MXM tires, and when it comes time to replace them, consider buying four 17" rims and MXV's then, assuming that I plan on keeping the car for a few more years from that point.
I actually have not tried the suggestion of lowering the tire pressure from 33 to 31 PSI to see if the ride improves, as other posts have suggested. I did note that when I got the car back with the Michelin's installed the fronts were set at 33 PSI, but the back were set at 29 PSI. I didn't like the way the vehicle was riding, and I raised the rear to 33 PSI, and the ride is actually better. The only residual ride annoyance I still observe is that when riding on smooth, but worn, blacktop roads, I seem to feel a sense of riding over a pebbly/gravelly surface, while when I ride on newer blacktop road surfaces, the ride is smooth. This is probably due to the stiffer suspension, as opposed to a softer suspension which would probably filter this out. A little more padding in the seat wouldn't hurt either.
To sum up, I know how well the Avalon can ride with the 17" rims and the MXV4's, but I'm not up to sinking in the cash to switch from 18" to 17" rims at this point. Maybe later on down the road, if I know I'll keep the car for many years.
P.S. Note that just going from 18" to 17" rims without also changing the tires to Michelin MXV4's does nothing to improve the ride in any meaningful way. I believe that this was mentioned in another post on this thread. Also, my observations comparing the Michelin Primacy MXV vs. the MXM tires agrees with the overall reviews of these tires on Tirerack.com. Both Michelins are vastly superior to the Bridgestone El400's, but the MXV is a little quieter than the MXM (but both rate in the excellent range).
#574 of 716 Re: 17" vs 18" tires [daveinva]
Jun 29, 2013 (2:55 pm)
Thanks for this thorough and careful analysis, which I am sure will be helpful to many forum users. I do believe, however, that you might try lowering the pressures to 31 PSI -- there is nothing to lose but the 5 or 10 minutes it will take to do it and I think you will agree that there is a noticeable improvement in the ride without detectable deterioration in handling, should you decide to go ahead with the change. Another 5 or 10 minutes will put you back where you were if you don't agree.
I think that one should also consider the possibility that Toyota, the largest manufacturer of cars in the world, might have known what they were doing when they put 18" rims on the top of the newly redesigned Avalon line. Handling and appearance are generally felt to improve with larger wheels, and many of the costliest and most admired performance/luxury cars such as Bentley sport wheels up to 20" in size.