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2012 - 2013 Toyota Avalon

494 messages,  Last post on May 22, 2013 at 2:34 PM

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Messages Page 43 of 50

#421 of 494 Re: '13 Ltd. vs. Hybrid (Ride/Handling) [solara01] by daveinva

Mar 05, 2013 (9:48 pm)

Replying to: solara01 (Mar 02, 2013 5:11 pm)
Hi,
 
I've been following this thread for a while, inasmuch as I recently purchased a 2013 Avalon Touring model and experienced the same ride quality concerns previously discussed with respect to the new 2013 model. I thought I'd pass along my experience and what I have found from my research.
 
Let me begin by saying that I'm not coming from an earlier Avalon with the nice, soft, cushy ride. My previous cars over the years were an Acura TL 3.2, a Nissan Maxima and the Avalon's predecessor, the Toyota Cressida. There are 4 trim levels for the '13 Avalon, the XLE and XLE Premium are equipped with the standard 17" rims with P215-55R17 tires, and the XLE Touring and Limited come with the "optional" 18" rims with P225-45R18 tires. My Touring model has the Bridgestone Turenza EL400 tires. I've been riding it around for the last few weeks...love the car except for the harsh/noisy ride (harsh on the bumpier local roads, and noisy on the high speed interstate).
 
I didn't get much satisfaction discussing ride quality with the sales or service folks at the dealer, so I went over to a local tire/rim/suspension customization shop in town. First thing he did was check tire pressure. All 4 tires were 6-7 pounds above the recommended 33 psi. After lowering to spec, there is a marked improvement in ride, although the road noise is still present due to the tires (more on that later). I also got the dealer to let me test ride an XLE Premium model with the 17" rims. I immediately noticed that this model was equipped with Michelin Primacy MVV4 tires.
 
The ride with the 17" Michelins is MUCH better than the ride with the 18" Bridgestones, although the lowered pressure now in the Bridgestones has helped the bumpy ride in my Touring model a fair amount. The 17" Michelins take the bumps and expansion joints in stride, while the tighter suspension helps the control of the vehicle in general. The take-away here is that you cannot ride the Avalon with the 17" rims and expect that the ride with the "optional" 18" rims will be similar, because they are not! Also, the Michelins are much quieter than the Bridgestones at freeway speeds.
 
With respect to the Toyota provided OEM tires, I recommend taking a look at the reviews of the Bridgestone Turenza EL400 over on the Tirerack.com website. These are poorly rated by the majority of reviewers, and are at the opposite end of the spectrum compared with the Michelin Primacy MXV4's, yet the retail costs are not that far apart. I have not submitted my customer satisfaction survey yet to Toyota, but one question will be asked is how come there is such a disparity in the tires provided for the Avalons? Be aware, however, that Michelin does not make the Primacy MXV4 tire in the size to fit the 18" rim, but instead offers the Primacy MXM tire, which is a newer design, which offers a little more performance and a little less ride comfort than the Primacy MXV4 (but probably better than the Bridgestone). Probably 50% of the ride improvement in the Avalon with the 17" rims is due to the extra sidewall with the smaller rims, and the other 50% in the ride improvement is due to the better tire.
 
What I'd like to suggest to Toyota is that they adjust their marketing of the Avalon to allow customers to choose whether or not they want to upsize the wheels on the Touring and Limited models to the "optional" 18" size. Right now, if you want the bells and whistles on the Touring and Limited, you are forced to take the larger 18" wheels. There is a trade-off here between a little better look to the tire vs. a better ride. Toyota would be smart to give that choice to the customer. It also would be nice if the dealer/sales folks would educate the potential Avalon customers as to the trade-off involved. Of course, when sales are brisk there is reduced incentive to do something along these lines.
 
For myself, I'm going to ride my Touring model with the 18" Bridgestones (set at the correct 33 PSI) for a while and see how that goes. FYI, the custom shop guy said I could lower the PSI down an additional 2-3 pounds to soften the ride a little more, but to stay above 30 PSI, to avoid having the TPMS trigger an alert (I believe he said it triggers around 7 PSI below the normal "set" value).
 
I hope this info helps the other folks here on the forum!

#422 of 494 Re: '13 Ltd. vs. Hybrid (Ride/Handling) [daveinva] by tjc78

Mar 06, 2013 (6:41 am)

Replying to: daveinva (Mar 05, 2013 9:48 pm)
I can't believe Toyota is still using that crappy disgrace of a tire (EL 400). Don't worry about riding on them too long, on my 06 Avalon they were toast by 27K with regular rotations (35PSI). They will get noiser as they wear as well.
 
The 06 was a such a great riding car even with that tire, but was even better with the Goodyears I put on afterward.

#423 of 494 Just Test Drove a 2013 Limited by almatti

Mar 07, 2013 (8:41 pm)

I've begun a journey to replace my 2010 Infiniti G37X coming due on the lease this summer. I have two categories for either I) a similar sized car ( Lateral selection) or upgrade to little larger car II) ( Upgrade Selection).
 
I) wait for the new 2014 G37X(summer of 2013); 2013 Acura TL SH_AWD; 2013 Lincoln MKZ Limited AWD; 2013 Buick LaCross AWD Limited; Nissan Maxima V-6 SL; a Hyundai or Kia ( not sure which model yet). Volvo S60 T-6 AWD(?); BMW 335 iX; even a 2013 Subaru Legacy 3.6R Limited (if it were a bit more upscale - it would very tempting {we own a 2010 Legacy 2.5i Premium which is a very good, solid commuter car].
 
II) 2013 Infiniti M37X; 2013 Audi A-6 3.0 Quatrro; 2013 MB E350 4Matic; Toyota 2013 Avalon; 2013 Lincoln MKS.
 
So I tested the Avalon the other day. My impressions are that as cited the Limited model rode harsh over local bumpy roads. Relatively smooth and quiet (I did not take it on the highway on this drive), The salesman didn't tell me that there are different handling settings. I found it to lag just a little ( 6 speed auto tranny) though not as bad as my 2010 G37X with a 7AT (check out those forums for the complaints about that Tranny). Handled pretty well, but I agree with other posters, the EL400 SUCK. they were probably filled too high IMO. The radio was so-so, a bit too Boomey for my liking. Nice looking car with a brilliant HD screen (everything is touch screen with buttons for the various selections : Radio, Navi, BT, etc. The buttons react almost too quickly (the salesman explained that there is new technology at work where the buttons react to your body heat). Many features that the M have as extras in a required technology package are included with the Avalon such as heated and cooled front seats, sliding rear shade, sideview mirrors that point down when in reverse, Blind side monitors, puddle lights, etc . And it's $20 K cheaper !!! ($60 K vs. $40K)
 
as I continue the evaluation process / shopping. I would give the Avalon a second look and more thorough test drive. 0% or .09% financing would serve to offer even stronger reconsideration in this category. That's not available NOW, but 4-6 months things change.

#424 of 494 17" vs 18" tires by douglas1

Mar 08, 2013 (11:58 am)

I have test driven the Premium with 215/55 17" tires and the Limited with225/45 18" tires and I was not able to discern much difference between the 2 rides. Admittedly the tests were on different roads and a week apart. I also drove a Hyundai Azera which had 245/40 19" tires and it seemed to ride much smoother than either Avalon and also seemed to handle better than my 2011 Avalon Limited.
 
There must be other suspension geometry things that are causing the new Avalon to ride more harshly than just the tire size.

#425 of 494 Re: 17" vs 18" tires [douglas1] by ncee

Mar 08, 2013 (12:18 pm)

Replying to: douglas1 (Mar 08, 2013 11:58 am)
I was told by Toyota it's the following:
 
- Tires
- Rims
- Shocks and the rest of the suspension. They are going for a more firm ride (maybe a bit sorry they didn't give options here)
- Tire Pressure
- Seat
- Person's size, person's weight, person's butt size / shape
 
to name butt a few reasons.
 
Not to mention, what is smooth and what is rough. Each person has a different thought on this.
 
Skip

#426 of 494 Motortrend Article by jeffm5

Mar 09, 2013 (7:32 am)

There's a report in the April issue of Motortrend comparing the new Avalon Limited with a Maxima and Azera. The Avalon won top honors just ahead of the Maxima. Their main complaint with the Avy is hard seats front and back and a harsh ride, which we keep hearing on this board.
 
The thing that caught my eye was the price as tested figure - Just short of $43,000.00 WOW!! Now granted this was a loaded Avy with the Tech package. But, just to compare numbers, I bought a loaded 2013 Volvo S60 (FWD) with a Tech package this summer. The MSRP was over $1,000.00 less.
 
BTW, I had a 1998 and a 2005 Avalon, which were great cars, so I'm not a Toyota or Avy basher.

#427 of 494 Re: Motortrend Article [jeffm5] by jeffm5

Mar 09, 2013 (7:36 am)

Replying to: jeffm5 (Mar 09, 2013 7:32 am)
CORRECTION - The Avalon nosed out the Azera, not the Maxima in the above mentioned Motortrend report. Sorry!!

#428 of 494 Re: Motortrend Article [jeffm5] by douglas1

Mar 09, 2013 (9:52 am)

Replying to: jeffm5 (Mar 09, 2013 7:36 am)
In a previous test Motortrend compared the 2012 Azera, carried over to 2013 with no changes, to the 2013 Lexus ES and they gave the nod to the Azera.
 
I went and checked out a new Azera again yesterday. I'm more impressed each time I see it. The sticking point for me is the rake of the windshield. If that was a little less raked I'd have already bought one.

#429 of 494 Re: 17" vs 18" tires [douglas1] by daveinva

Mar 10, 2013 (3:44 pm)

Replying to: douglas1 (Mar 08, 2013 11:58 am)
Hi Again,
 
I just managed to do another test ride in a 2013 XLE Premium with the 17" wheels fitted with the Bridgestone EL400 tires (P215-55R17). I agree that I did not find much ride difference between that Avalon and my Touring model with the 18" wheels fitted with the Bridgestone EL400 tires (P225-45R18), particularly after adjusting the tire pressure on my 18 inchers to the recommended 33 PSI. Thus, I conclude that with the Bridgestone's on both the 18" and 17" Avalon wheels, there is not much improvement in the ride based just on the wheel size.
 
HOWEVER, as I indicated in my earlier post, I also test drove a 2013 XLE Premium with 17" wheels fitted with Michelin Primacy MXV4 tires (P215-55R17). There is a world of difference in the ride between the Michelin's and the Bridgestones. The Michelins are much quieter at highway speeds, and they absorb the bumps and expansion joint vibrations very well. In fact, I also went out for a drive in my neighbors 2011 Avalon Limited (3rd generation suspension system) fitted with 17" wheels with the Bridgestone EL400's. I thought that the 2013 Avalon with the Michelins rode just as well as the 2011, with the bonus of improved handling due to the new suspension in the 4th generation model.
 
When my EL400's wear out, I'll put Michelin Primacy MXM4's on my 18" wheels. The Primacy MXV4's are not made in the 18" size, but the Primacy MXM4's (which are available in the P225-45R18 size) are pretty close in performance. Unfortunately, as I am now only driving around 6000 miles per year, even with the short life of the EL400's, I'm looking at 2-3 years before replacement (unless I decide to bite the bullet and switch them out sooner).
 
Be careful when looking at Michelin's though, as their tire naming scheme is a little confusing. The Primacy's are all-season touring tires, whereas the other product lines such as the Energy, Pilot and Defender are different designs with different ride characteristics, and probably will not soften the ride of the 2013 Avalon as much as the Primacy's.

#430 of 494 Re: 17" vs 18" tires [daveinva] by douglas1

Mar 10, 2013 (4:34 pm)

Replying to: daveinva (Mar 10, 2013 3:44 pm)
Thanks Dave, very insightful analysis. Apparently all Touring and Limited models come with the Bridgestone's which is unfortunate. I'd like something that rides similar to my 2011 Limited, not floaty but not as harsh as the new Avalon's I've test drove.
 
I wonder how the Michelin Primacy MXV4 would do on my 2011 with regard to quietness and ride.
 
How do you find the seats? My first and test drive impression is that they are very hard and not too comfortable.

Messages Page 43 of 50

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