Last post on Feb 16, 2011 at 9:49 AM
You are in the Subaru Legacy & Outback
What is this discussion about?
Subaru Legacy, Subaru Outback, Sedan, Wagon
#1 of 26 2012 Outback Diesel?
Feb 07, 2011 (3:33 pm)
I was looking around for a threat about the 2012 model coming around. We should start seeing them around June of this year in the US if it follows last year's schedule.
In other parts of the world, Subaru offers a diesel version of the Outback. Think anything like this is in the works for the US? I'd love to have a diesel - the price difference is around 10% extra for fuel in this area of the country, but you get far better fuel economy (and no annoying spark plugs!)
Any big changes on the horizon for the 12's? I imagine the next big change will be their Tribeca line, as the others have recently had new generations of models released within the last 2 years.
#2 of 26 Re: 2012 Outback Diesel? [pilot1226]
Feb 08, 2011 (8:55 am)
I doubt it, because the current diesel engine does not meet CARB standards. That means it could not be sold in California and several northeastern states, the latter which is Subaru's primary market.
So it won't happen until the next generation clean diesel, at least.
#3 of 26 Re: 2012 Outback Diesel? [pilot1226]
Feb 08, 2011 (3:34 pm)
What would be the benefit? Diesel is about 20% higher in most parts of the country. AND I doubt if a Subaru diesel would get 20% better mileage.
I don't get your statement: (and no annoying spark plugs!)
Today you don't have to do anything to your plugs for 100K. That doesn't seem annoying to me.
How often do you change or clean your plugs?
On the other hand, I have always found my diesel autos to be annoying because I have to wear gloves to fuel and have to watch out about stepping in a pool of diesel fuel that someone just spilled where I am filling up. Every tracked diesel fuel on your shoes to your floor mats. This was not a deal killer, just annoying things.
I for one can't think of any reason to have a diesel anything today,(other than in a tuck for pulling) because of the extra cost in purchase, repairs, and fuel.
Repairs: ie: You can replace a complete gas engine for the price of a head job on a diesel. Had a friend who had his Ford diesel truck motor rebuilt--$15K! just for a rebuild.
Diesel in a car used to be a real +. Today there is no benefit.
Sorry if it seems I'm stirring the pot. These are just my feeling with a long history of gas and diesel cars.
Why do you think a diesel motor in a Subaru would be a benefit to you and other buyers of Subarus (or any other cars)?
#4 of 26 Re: 2012 Outback Diesel? [clarkkent]
Feb 09, 2011 (9:11 am)
For me one word: Range.
You could drive forever on one tank.
Around here diesel costs about 10-12% more, but you can get about 20% better efficiency.
It takes a long, long time to recover the extra up front costs, but you enjoy more range the whole life of the car.
#5 of 26 Re: 2012 Outback Diesel? [ateixeira]
Feb 09, 2011 (5:49 pm)
No Diesels for SOA in the foreseeable future. That's the word I got. You will see a hybrid before a Diesel in the USDM market.
Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
#6 of 26 Re: 2012 Outback Diesel? [paisan]
Feb 10, 2011 (9:14 am)
You're probably right, but I think that's a bad strategy.
Given the relationship with Toyota, hedge their bets with Toyota doing hybrids and Subaru doing diesels.
This is putting all their eggs in one basket!
#7 of 26 Thanks for the responses!
Feb 10, 2011 (11:53 am)
Thanks for the responses. I live in NJ, so I can't pump my gas anyway (without getting dirty looks from the gas attendants) so I don't really care about the fueling thing.
As for the spark plugs, I started a thread a few weeks ago about the upcoming 30k service on my Legacy, in which the owner's manual instructs you to replace the spark plugs every 30k miles. (2009, 2.5 engine)
The range is nice, yeah.
I know several people that have diesels, primarily the Volkswagen TDI, that have been pretty pleased with the cost of ownership and maintenance.
A hybrid sounds nice, but I don't really think it's worth it overall. While true, you do reduce your amount of gasoline consumed, you're also creating some hazardous waste (the battery will EVENTUALLY have to get disposed of, somewhere, which will probably have ecological impacts). Even plug-in hybrids have issues - you're now creating more of a demand for electrical power, which means electricity production will have to increase - which is generated by burning coal, etc. in the majority of the country.
So, yes, we're "saving" carbon emissions by not burning as much gasoline, but now what? We're creating harmful waste and potentially more carbon emissions (among other things, like sulfur) by burning MORE coal to generate electricity for our plug-in hybrids.
#8 of 26 Re: Thanks for the responses! [pilot1226]
Feb 10, 2011 (12:20 pm)
Nickel-metal hydride batteries are less harmful than the lead-acid most regular cars have. You could bury them in soil and have a raised-bed garden.
That's not the case for Li-ion or newer tech batteries, though.
#9 of 26 Re: Thanks for the responses! [ateixeira]
Feb 10, 2011 (2:36 pm)
And to add to juice's reply, the automakers themselves put a pretty high bounty on the battery packs to get them recycled. Toyota pays $200 for a Prius battery pack. They then recycle it to capture the precious metals which are reused.
#10 of 26 Re: Thanks for the responses! [pilot1226]
Feb 10, 2011 (6:32 pm)
Pilot, shoot me an e-mail about your 30k. paisanazpinstalls.com
Subaru Guru and Track Instructor