Last post on Jul 16, 2013 at 2:56 PM
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Honda Civic, Car Buying, Hybrid Cars, Automotive News, Future Vehicle, Coupe, Sedan
#99 of 224 Re: Elanta 2011 vs Civic 2012 [isellhondas]
May 13, 2011 (4:01 am)
Yeah, some cars were more/less damaged depending on which part of town they were in when the storm hit BUT in my case both were 10 feet apart and I can assure you the Honda took the much larger hit (pun intended!). Very thin sheet metal on at least the trunk lid, hood, and roof surfaces. Even damaged along the flanks of the car. So, if the intent was to "prove" that all kinds of cars can be damaged from severe hail that much is true but when the Honda looked like the cars on that recent TV commercial (for an insurance company) where a lawn tractor runs through a gravel pit peppering two cars with thrown gravel and the Dodge survived intact for the most part...well, no one will convince me the Honda isn't inferior as far as sheet metal integrity. End of "my" story.
#100 of 224 Re: Elanta 2011 vs Civic 2012 [targettuning]
May 13, 2011 (6:27 am)
About ten years ago, a freak hailstorm hit our area. It missed our store but hit a nearby Honda dealer. Cars were literally parked side by side. Some cars had pretty bad damage and others were barely affected. All were Hondas so please explain that one!
If the truth be known I would think that sheet metal thickness isn't going to vary much between different makes of cars.
#101 of 224 Re: Elantra GLS is a lower trim level than Civic EX [faircomparo]
May 13, 2011 (6:48 am)
In my 14 years of selling Hondas, we did let a few people out on their own but I NEVER had someone leave for three hours. The words "exhaustive test" would have waved red flags at me.
Most people that do things like that are non serious joyriders or strokes.
You were the exception and I still think what you did was over the top even though the car was sold.
100 miles? Three hours? 90 MPH? Sorry, unnecessary, abusive and WAY over the top!
#102 of 224 2012 LX sit test
May 13, 2011 (8:35 am)
I checked out a 2012 LX at my local dealer today. Did not drive it because I won't be buying a car until next year, and didn't want to waste the sales rep's time. My impressions:
* Comfortable driving position, although the wheel doesn't tilt up quite as much as I'd like. Also would like a little more thigh support (common issue with single-lever height adjusters).
* Cloth looked nice but seemed kinda thin compared to Civics of yore.
* Lots of hard grey plastic on the dash. Decent quality plastic, but a step below interiors of competitors such as Cruze, Focus, Mazda3, and Elantra.
* Snazzy display for radio and other functions. Also could be distracting to the driver, IMO. Position was nice, though--in the instrument binnacle vs. in the center of the dash. I wonder how visible it is to the front passenger?
* Plastic wheel was thick and has audio, computer, and cruise controls.
* Armrests were padded with cloth, albeit thinly.
* Vanity mirrors not illuminated.
* Rear seat legroom was more than Cruze, maybe a tad more than Focus, and less than Elantra and Jetta. In the sit-behind-me test (I'm 5'9-1/2"), my ankles hit the bottom of the front seat before my thighs were resting fully on the seat, i.e. "knees in the air" syndrome. Good foot space though. No rear center armrest as most competitors have. Rear seat only folds in one piece--need to get the EX for 60/40 (which most competitors have standard). Headroom was fine in back (and in front).
* Glove box seemed big, but lid falls open with a "clunk" (not damped).
* Doors close with a nice "thunk".
* Plastic wheel covers looked OK on the 15" wheels (down from 16" on the 2011 Civic).
* Trunk was roomy. Lid has conventional hinges vs. struts (seems more and more new cars are moving back to the cheaper hinges).
Overall, an improvement over the 2011 Civic, especially in rear seat room and some added features such as ESC and audio controls on the wheel. Also improved fuel economy. But considering it's about $1000 more than an Elantra GLS that has 16" alloys, Bluetooth, XM radio, roomier back seat with center armrest, nicer dash and door panels, heated mirrors, illuminated vanity mirrors, rear disc brakes, one more cog in the AT, 60/40 rear seat, and a longer warranty, the value proposition is questionable. Will have to wait until a test drive to see if the everyday driving dynamics make up for the difference.
#103 of 224 Re: 2012 LX sit test [backy]
May 13, 2011 (1:42 pm)
Great sitting review of the new Civic! You're summary of info is correct for the 2012 LX except for rear seat leg room. We looked at a LX Civic and took it on a test drive before exchanging it for an EX. The LX is definatly outclassed by its competition for features and even though it drives well, it's outclassed by its better equipped sibling the EX. [Just a note of comparison the EX is quiter to drive than the LX]
When we had both the '11 Elantra and '12 Civic parked side by side we slid both front seats all the way back as far as they would go to compare seat room. The Civic had about 1.5" more legroom than the Elantra in the back seat. Sitting in the back my knees just cleared the Elantra's front seat while I had a couple of inches to spare in the Civic. However, the Elantra had about 2" more room in the front seats. But the Civic's rear seats like it's front seats were more comfortable to sit in than the Elantra's. The front seat room in the Civic was fine I'd say for a 6' 6" driver while the Elantra could possibly be comfortable for a 6' 10" driver. I think the Civic got the balance just right for the average height range of drivers for both front and rear occupants. The new '12 Civic has more cabin room overall than the '11 model. This is substantiated by the new models interior cabin dimensions.
My only wish was that the LX and EX both had a better combination of cabin materials and a better overall dash. But interestingly, instrumentation design and erogonomics were better in the Civic than in the Elantra. But as far as first impressions go the Elantra wins. However, drive both for a while and try adjusting the controls while driving the Elantra it's not as easy to do as it is in the Civic which wins for perfect placement of everything. It may not look as pretty but it is sure functional. Controls are all at correct height, gauges are sweet and everything is simple to use. Not so for the Elantra, Hyandai has placed form over function in the Elantra's cabin. It's like they had an item check list and yes everything is there, it looks initially a nice design until you try using while driving. It's like they forgot the road test it. You will have to test both cars together or as closly as possible to see which car you like more. But you must road test both to find the Civic's hidden qualities. I've now read a few professional reviews and they're saying simlar things, that the '12 Civic is a better overall car than the Elantra.
#104 of 224 Re: 2012 LX sit test [faircomparo]
May 13, 2011 (2:08 pm)
When we had both the '11 Elantra and '12 Civic parked side by side we slid both front seats all the way back as far as they would go to compare seat room.
IMO that is not a good way to test rear seat room. The only reason the Elantra has less rear seat room based on how you did the test is because its front seat moves back several inches farther than on the Civic!
I test rear seat room by adjusting the driver's seat so it is comfortable for me, then I sit in the left back seat. (My wife is shorter than I am.) That tells me how much USABLE rear seat room there is. Based on that test, the Elantra has more rear seat room than the Civic.
Can you please post the links to the professional reviews of the Civic you've seen? I haven't seen any yet. Thanks.
#106 of 224 Re: Elanta 2011 vs Civic 2012 [samnoe]
May 13, 2011 (5:21 pm)
The 2012 Civic is a much quiter more refined driver than the 06-11 model. The road noise is more subdued and then wind noise is greatly reduced. We found driving at high speed relaxed and in line with the Focus and Cruze. But the Toyota 2012 Corolla seemed quieter at speed.
Ride quality also is up to par with the best in class Ford Focus and Mazda 3. Actually, the Civic can be driven just as fast and is a little more comfortable over the bumps and bad surfaces than the Focus. The suspension is softer but still provides ample control and grip. Some may complain about The electric steering, it's not as direct as the '11 model but I found it drove just as good ans was more composed over rough roads. On the freeway is was definitely way more relaxed to drive. Just drove straight and cornered with a new found ease. Didn't rail or wander like the '11 tended to want to do. But there is a little more body roll, but nothing bad or unnatural.
The sound system in the 2012 Civic EX is way better. There is a high fidelity to the sound. The Elantra's sounded flat. The 160w stereo was ample to provide clear highs and solid but not thumping bass.
#107 of 224 Re: 2012 LX sit test [faircomparo]
May 13, 2011 (6:19 pm)
By "extra inch of room", what do you mean? Do you mean space between knees and front seat back? That is immaterial to me, as long as the knees aren't hitting the seat. What is important is how far I can stretch my legs out, are my thighs fully supported, and is there enough toe space. The big difference I found between the Civic and Elantra in the rear is that there was enough stretch-out space in the Elantra so my thighs were supported, and my ankles weren't pressed into the front seat to do it. Maybe its rear seat is higher than the Civic's? Both had sufficient toe space and knee space.
Thanks for posting all the reviews. But in the Automobile Magazine comparo, I don't see where they score the Civic 2nd. I only see where they give their overall top pick, the Focus. It was probably the most useful review though... some of them seemed as if they didn't drive the car at all, or if so didn't say much about their experience.
I think the BusinessWeek review summed it up best:
The bottom line: Buying a Honda Civic used to be a no-brainer. These days it pays to comparison shop and do some test-drives before signing on the dotted line.
May 23, 2011 (4:21 pm)
I cannot understand why everybody is talking up Honda so much. I can tell, from being a soon to be ex-owner of a 7th Gen, 2003 LX, manual, there is much that stinks about Honda anymore.
First the new car. Why did they not tweak the engine for at least 10-15 HP and TQ?
Where is the 6 speed auto that Ford and Chevy now have?
Why is the interior even more plastic-laden then previously?
Its a dud. I don't care what they say about better MPG, my 2003 when brand new could easily do high 30's to low 40's going 65-80MPH. How have they improved on this? The leg room between my 7th Gen and the 8th Gen is not even close, I have more.
While the manual on the 8th Gen is quicker then mine, the auto is not. Yet if should be given that is has 5 forward gears, just like my manual, and 20 more horsepower. Why the hell can't Honda engineer an auto or a manual that does not constantly leave you flat footed when you need the power most, merging on the highway, or passing on a two lane road. The gear splits need to be closer and lower geared on each until overdrive. Whats the point of having a 5 speed automatic that does not have much better splits, such as 30 in first, 50 in second, 80 in third etc., etc. This would give the car so much better power in the passing and merging scenario. Rather its now 36 in 1st, like 67 in 2nd, 100 in 3rd, etc. Same with the manual BTW. A bunch of moronic engineers.
Also, any of you who might have owned a 7th Gen, they suck. They are full of problems. Transmission(Auto and Manual), Exhaust Manifold Cracking, easily warped front brake rotors. I can say that it still beats the new cars hands down for the quality of cloth on the seats and the slick dash, at least until the carpet on the doors falls off from inferior bonding agent.
I really think you all should think real hard before going with a Honda now. I am not joking by saying that it feels like these guys have been a 21st century hangover, and have no clue how to get out of it.
The 8th Gen is a buggy mess. With all the new electronics, the thing gives false readings all over the place, on the OBD 2 indicator. I really think it won the car of the year in 2006 only because everybody else had inferior vehicles in that year.
As for me, I am considering the new Focus, Elentra, not any GM stuff though. If you want a good Honda, buy a 2000 or before, they really do last a long time I have heard.