Ask the Car People.SM


Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs - READ ONLY

30 messages,  Last post on Jun 23, 2010 at 9:49 AM

You are in the Automotive News & Views-Archives Forum.

What is this discussion about? Car Values

Messages Page 1 of 3

#1 of 30 Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs by hpmctorque

May 26, 2010 (10:16 pm)

Modern cars, and especially the German ones, tend to be satisfying to drive, and they look elegant, but they're expensive to operate. The ever expanding list of new electronic features, plus the fact that more and more brands force you to go to the dealer for certain maintenance items, increase the cost-of-ownership. I say it's too high, and is costing.
  
The upshot is that the cost of car ownership keeps climbing. Have you discovered ways to decrease your cost of owning your wheels that you'd like to share with other readers?

#2 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [hpmctorque] by hpmctorque

May 27, 2010 (5:51 am)

Replying to: hpmctorque (May 26, 2010 10:16 pm)
In the last sentence of the first paragraph, above, I had intended to say, "...it's too high, and is rising."
 
My point is that, increasingly, the manufacturers have us boxed in, on cost-of-ownership. Leasing is expensive. Buying and trading every 3-6 years is expensive, and keeping a car for the long haul is expensive. If the depreciation doesn't get you, sooner, then the cost of parts and labor will get you later. The only way out is to buy a basic 4 cylinder, with few options.
 
But wasn't it always this way? I'd say it's gotten worse in the last several years, as cars above the basic models, especially, have become increasingly complex.

#3 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [hpmctorque] by anythngbutgm

May 27, 2010 (5:59 am)

Replying to: hpmctorque (May 26, 2010 10:16 pm)
What helps with the German cars (and one of the factors that keeps them in the running when it comes time to shop) is many of them include maintenance for the first few years on new vehicles and then buying a used one gets a typical 100k warranty from the dealer which can take care of a majority of the items.
 
I still stick to Japanese for all out reliability though. In my experience, they have been exceptional.

#4 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [anythngbutgm] by hpmctorque

May 27, 2010 (7:11 am)

Replying to: anythngbutgm (May 27, 2010 5:59 am)
I agree on both points regarding the German cars, and that, in most cases, the Japanese set the standard on reliability. And, from what one reads, Ford and GM have largely closed the gap with the Japanese.
 
What puzzles me is the relatively large number of out-of-warranty German cars that are still in existence. Excluding owners who do all or most of their own maintenance and repairs, maybe, how do owners of out-of-warranty German (and Swedish) cars justify the cost-of-ownership?

#5 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [hpmctorque] by anythngbutgm

May 27, 2010 (7:15 am)

Replying to: hpmctorque (May 27, 2010 7:11 am)
I would expect those hefty numbers of Europeans cars are off lease, with many of those folks turning in every 2 - 3 years for a new one. I myself don't know many people who have actually bought rather than leased a European vehicle.

#6 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [hpmctorque] by fintail

May 27, 2010 (9:33 am)

Replying to: hpmctorque (May 27, 2010 7:11 am)
I think a big part of it is that while some of the cars become money pits, the majority of them aren't too bad, and they deliver enough pleasure to the owner to keep them going. As you say, there is no shortage of aging Euro cars out there, many of them in decent condition.

#7 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [hpmctorque] by kathyc2

May 27, 2010 (12:28 pm)

Replying to: hpmctorque (May 27, 2010 7:11 am)
how do owners of out-of-warranty German (and Swedish) cars justify the cost-of-ownership?
 
LOL! We don't look at the cost to get from point A to B, but rather the fun to get from A to B, with a slight detour to take the most fun rather than the most direct route.

#8 of 30 Trying to beat Economics by kernick

May 27, 2010 (1:09 pm)

It sounds to me like you want luxury, but don't want to pay the price for luxury, as many of the German and European vehicles that reach our shores are luxurious. But by definition these vehicles wouldn't be luxurious, if everyone and their brother could afford to buy one and to keep it on the road! There is NO generally known way to beat the economics if you're going to buy a luxury vehicle new.
 
What I did as buy my '05 Jag X-Type used after 2.5 years and 30K miles. That left quite a bit of warranty. I paid about $19K for it or about 55% of the MSRP. My wife and I have driven it for 2 years and 20K miles and have had to buy 1 tire which was due to a cracked rim. I'm sure brakes will be due soon. But I don't go to a dealer for normal maintenance. I have not had any problem getting oil-changes, wipers, tires, air-filters, and such. I don't expect to ever have much trouble getting shocks or struts if needed, or to have fluids changed. I'll probably even go down the parts-store and buy 6 spark-plugs, gap them and put them in myself (if the location looks reasonable).
 
I guess if you have a lemon that involves proprietary software then you might be stuck going back to the dealer. But then again I do see the flaw with having some NAV system be the interface for HVAC, stereo ... I would avoid any vehicle that has a lot of unneeded extras tied into a NAV system.

#9 of 30 Re: Trapped Between High Depreciation, and Expensive Maintenance and Repairs [hpmctorque] by andys120

May 27, 2010 (5:04 pm)

Replying to: hpmctorque (May 26, 2010 10:16 pm)
The upshot is that the cost of car ownership keeps climbing. Have you discovered ways to decrease your cost of owning your wheels that you'd like to share with other readers?
 
Good questions and as a multi-owner of high-mileage German and Swedish iron I can tell you how to keep costs within reason.
 
1) Buy used. BMWs Porsche and the like lose up to 50% of their value in the first three or four years of service. I boiught my current 2000 528iA with four years and 44K on it for $26,000 which is about half the sticker price when new and the approximate cost of a new Camry with equivalent options.
 
2)Stay away from dealers. There are lots of good independent service outfits for the German makes and (at least in New England) the Euro makes who will work much cheaper than the dealers.
 
3)Don't skimp on maintenence. Have all required services done and done on time.
Euro cars have much less tolerance for poor maintenance than Japanese or American cars.
 
4)Have fun! These cars are great to drive and you don't need to be afraid to push them from time to time. A car meant to stand up to autobahn travel at century speeds will last for a long time under American driving condition.
 
The Blue Max is one of several BMWS, Audis and Saabs that I've driven well past their warranty period (it's now 121K and going strong.) Would you rather have this or a six y/o Camry?>
 

Messages Page 1 of 3

Advertisement

Browse by Category

Browse by Vehicle
   View All Vehicles

Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
View All Topics

Edmunds Community

Advertisement