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#245 of 3623 Is Toyota hiding the real defect?
Jan 31, 2010 (8:43 am)
This supposed "fix" by Toyota may not be the answer. Could Toyota be hiding a much larger problem which it is afraid to admit?
Recent article in the LA Times.
By Ralph Vartabedian and Ken Bensinger LOS ANGELES TIMES 1/30/10
The pedal maker denies that its products are at fault. Some independent safety experts also are skeptical of Toyota's explanations. 'We know this recall is a red herring,' one says.
Toyota Motor Corp.'s decision to blame its widening sudden-acceleration problem on a gas pedal defect came under attack Friday, with the pedal manufacturer flatly denying that its products were at fault.
Federal vehicle safety records reviewed by The Times also cast doubt on Toyota's claims that sticky gas pedals were a significant factor in the growing reports of runaway vehicles. Of more than 2,000 motorist complaints of sudden acceleration in Toyota and Lexus vehicles over the last decade, just 5% blamed a sticking gas pedal, the analysis found.
What's more, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has conducted eight investigations into sudden-acceleration problems in Toyota vehicles over the last seven years, none of which identified a sticking pedal as a potential cause.
Independent auto safety experts have been skeptical of Toyota's explanations, saying floor mats and sticky gas pedals can't fully explain the large number of complaints that have been mounting for the last decade, covering some of the most popular models in the company's lineup, including the Camry.
That argument was given more weight Friday when the manufacturer of the suspect pedals insisted its products had been unfairly blamed.
CTS Corp. of Elkhart, Ind., said in a statement that it had "deep concern that there is widespread confusion and incorrect information" about its products linked to the sudden-acceleration issue.
"The problem of sudden unintended acceleration has been reported to have existed in some Lexus vehicles and Toyota vehicles going back to 1999, when CTS did not even make this product for any customer," the company said.
Toyota began using CTS-made pedals in the 2005 model year.
#246 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [KarenS]
Jan 31, 2010 (9:47 am)
Whether the problem is what Toyota claims it is or not, it would make a whole lot more sense to design a retrofit kit to allow hitting the brake to override the throttle. That would guarantee that no matter what is wrong with the throttle that the braking system will stop the car. I know they say that feature will be introduced on the 2011 models but all their cars electronic throttles should have this feature. That would guarantee safety. If any of the cars with the shim kit continue to have this problem Toyota will be up shits creek. They need to do it right the first time if they want to rescue their reputation.
#247 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [20vtguy]
Jan 31, 2010 (10:03 am)
This brake override system is already being installed in all possible vehicles as they're being brought in.
If an owner is involved in either of the two recalls then the brake override function will be added to that vehicle. New models are getting it installed in the factories.
#248 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [KarenS]
Jan 31, 2010 (10:15 am)
In addition to fix Toyota should update their engine computer software so that it would produce and store error information regarding engine RPM's and throttle position maintaining or increasing at any time while the brake is applied and the car is in gear. That way if a customer complains of unintended acceleration the dealership can simply check the computer to see if an error of that nature is stored. That would prove any unintended acceleration and also help isolate the cause.
#249 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [20vtguy]
Jan 31, 2010 (10:44 am)
20, do you really think that Toyota (or any other automotive manufacturer) would agree to letting the dealer/customer see data that proves their software is causing accidents or killing people. This is information that car owners (or lawyers) will never be able to get their hands on!
I do think that the current "unintended acceleration" problem is somehow tied to the Toyota software, and maybe will finally be corrected with a software change, but we as owners, will never know the exact scope of the fix.
#250 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [popsavalon]
Jan 31, 2010 (11:23 am)
we as owners, will never know the exact scope of the fix.
More like we as owners, will never know the exact scope of the true underlining problem.
#251 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [kdhspyder]
Jan 31, 2010 (11:48 am)
There is no over ride software being installed when your recalled Toyota is serviced.
The new models getting that software won't get it until start of next year production.
The "fix" involves a spacer being installed in the existing pedal.
#252 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [popsavalon]
Jan 31, 2010 (11:52 am)
If this feature is in addition to installing the throttle override system then the risk of accidents in unintended acceleration situations is down to basically nothing so therefore it job would be just like any other error code such as low oil pressure. The dealer can identify a problem and fix it. It would not only avoid accidents caused by the problem but would be able confirm a problem. Obviously since adding a feature like this to Toyotas after the fact would certainly be used as ammo in lawsuits I can understand your remark but if the accidents and injuries are avoided because of these safety additions then there is nothing to sue for so Toyota has nothing to worry about.
#253 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [lbthedawg]
Jan 31, 2010 (12:29 pm)
You're wrong. The brake override is being installed already, it began in December. Get your facts straight before posting.
#254 of 3623 Re: Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall [kdhspyder]
Jan 31, 2010 (1:03 pm)
I hope you are right on the brake override being installed on vehicles since Dec.
I have one ready to be delivered which was assembled in Jan sitting on the dealers lot. I was supposed to pick it up Jan 30 but the recall stopped delivery.