Last post on Oct 29, 2013 at 7:25 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views
What is this discussion about?
Toyota Camry, Toyota RAV4, Toyota Highlander, Toyota Corolla, Toyota Avalon, Toyota Tundra, Toyota Sequoia, Pontiac Vibe, Automotive News
#1119 of 3623 Re: Toyota RAV4 Recall [sharonkl]
Feb 10, 2010 (6:26 am)
I have a 2008 RAV4 and I too am having the accelerator issue. I do a lot of mountain driving with switchback turns, so I'm accelerating & braking often. I started noticing it about 8 months ago. The times I'm aware of it is when I'm going down hill and applying my brakes; there is a slight hesitation in the acceleration. It feels as though the accelerator is still being applied as I am braking.
I didn't make much about it, until the recalls made me think it might be the same issue in the 2008 models. I'm planning to bring it into the dealer to make them aware of it.
#1120 of 3623 Re: UA not being addressed.... [oparr]
Feb 10, 2010 (6:37 am)
oparr...the recalls extend to not only North America, but to Europe and China, too. Other recalls are also being done in Japan that include hybrids. So, for all intents and purposes, the recall is world wide.
#1122 of 3623 WSJ: Secretive Culture Led Toyota Astray
Feb 10, 2010 (6:45 am)
Below is a link to an article critical article of Toyota's relationship with NHTSA and response to growing complaints of UA. It's available to non-subscribers.
In defense of Toyota, NHSTA also couldn't find a pattern of problems that justified a specific action until they focused on the floor mats. More significantly, in a survey of 1,986 Lexus ES350 owners, 59 of which reported incidents of UA, 35 of them attributed it to a floor mat problem.
The article's opening paragraph is a little sensationalist, considering how unimportant the gas pedal problem is in the UA issue, still, it's worthwhile reading.
#1124 of 3623 Re: WSJ: Secretive Culture Led Toyota Astray [lzc]
Feb 10, 2010 (6:59 am)
>In defense of Toyota, NHSTA also couldn't find a pattern of problems that justified a specific action
Have to disagree there. Toyota found enough evidence they wanted the NHSTA to only look at unintended acceleration reports that were 1 second or shorter. Isn't that _odd_? I believe it was because if the whole range to times of endurance of the incident were collected and reported, IT WAS CLEAR there was a problem.
Toyota's hands are dirty and Sarcutti, past employee of NHSTA, is in the middle.
#1125 of 3623 Re: Car Runs on Code [mtrialsm]
Feb 10, 2010 (7:03 am)
I'll also reinforce your view. I work as an engineer in a global company designing the processes in the factory. Software, electronics, and automation in general are great for efficiency, and doing jobs that people can't or don't want to do.
However it is not only susceptible to internal problems like bad code or bad hardware on the boards; but is susceptible to environmental issues - people bumping something out of alignment, a piece of fiber floating and landing on a sensor, a fluctuation in electrical supply causing the CPU to crash ...
And because these systems are so complex, it make finding the problem that much more difficult and requires highly trained people, with knowledge of that system, to troubleshoot it.
I also think it is a bad idea to make all these auto systems electronic, unless there is a manual override. I'd like to see the NHTSA take up this issue. They should make regulations that state that engine control, braking and steering system designs can be electronically controlled, ONLY IF the design provides for the driver to continue to operate those systems by having manual control, should the electronic system fail. I'm pretty sure planes are designed this way?
#1126 of 3623 Re: UA not being addressed.... [oparr]
Feb 10, 2010 (7:08 am)
"Why is it that Toyota's UA woes seem essentially endemic to the USA?"
accidents are a combination of the vehicles, people and the environment the vehicle / people combination operates.
since the same vehicles are involved where different accident outcome is generated, you have to conclude that the difference is in the people / environment combo.
of course, that assumes that you are rationale and willing to face the fact. a thing that not many people have the guts to do.
#1127 of 3623 Re: Car Runs on Code [kernick]
Feb 10, 2010 (7:13 am)
"They should make regulations that state that engine control, braking and steering system designs can be electronically controlled, ONLY IF the design provides for the driver to continue to operate those systems by having manual control, should the electronic system fail. "
I would rather that I make that decision, not some bureacrats in Washington. If the guy had trouble articulating his answer to a simple question ("what should the Toyota customers do?"), how good is he going to make such an important decision for me?
"I'm pretty sure planes are designed this way?"
not always. earlier fly-by-wire systems did have mechanical back-ups, as those systems were "unproven" at that point. Today's fly-by-wire systems are far more reliable than their mechanical back-up will ever be, to the point that no mechanical back-up is used on modern commercial airplanes.
They do have redundancy systems, usually electric or electronic ones, but that was true for earlier mechanical systems as well (in that they were backed up by another mechanical or electric systems).
#1128 of 3623 Re: WSJ: Secretive Culture Led Toyota Astray [lzc]
Feb 10, 2010 (7:22 am)
"More significantly, in a survey of 1,986 Lexus ES350 owners, 59 of which reported incidents of UA, 35 of them attributed it to a floor mat problem. "
to me, that (59 out of 600 responded and 1986 surveyed owners) is a very high (extremely and unacceptably high) rate of defect.
If that reports is true, both NHTSA and Toyota should be blamed. while the high rate isn't necessarily a reflection of design / manufacturing flaws but actions should have been taken to figure out the root causes behind it.
On another topic, I never understood how sticky pedals could possibly explain "sudden acceleration" and all the media hoopla (and retarded journalism) made it that much more difficult to figure out precisely what happened in those accidents.
On the other hand, the media is in the business of generating viewership, not reporting the truth / facts anymore.