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Automotive News & Views Cash for Clunkers - Good or Bad Idea?
4110 messages, Last post on Nov 23, 2009 at 11:42 AM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
For questions about how the program works or to discuss program details, please visit our discussion titled, "Cash for Clunkers - Does it Work for You?"
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Oct 31, 2009 8:52 pm) ----------------------------------------------------------- Here's one place we agree completely. It's not far off now and by next summer it is almost certain unless our entire economy collapses. --------------------------------------------------------- I was in favor of C4C but was surprised by the turnout. I expected the 2nd $2 billion to last through Sept. Americans can't pass up a perceived bargain and that part of it worked perfectly. That said, I still agree in principle with edmunds.com stance that most of these sales would have occurred in the 3rd & 4th qtr of '09 without C4C. Next year we have to turn off some of the spending and let nature take it's course. It won't be pretty for a while but our long term future is still bright. |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Oct 31, 2009 5:53 pm) Please advise; Where did the money come from which went to the automakers to replenish dealers' inventories whose lots were emptied by the CFC program? Please supply the answers to your four questions as I am unable to accurately obtain those exact figures. Regards, DQ |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Oct 31, 2009 6:28 pm) You're gonna have to explain that one a bit more. What increased withholding taxes from individuals - car salesmen? Most/all of the benefit went to the auto makers. The D3 anyway are stlill operating at a loss or with losses on the books carried over from previous years. So they are paying no income taxes anyway. Just for the record, I agree with the "all the money that won't be spent on fuel on these dead clunks over the next 3 to 7 years" comment.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Oct 31, 2009 8:52 pm) But, that's bad from a tax revenue standpoint, isn't it? Better fuel economy means less gas purchased means less tax revenues. Maybe those lower tax revenues over 10 years or so balances out or even exceeds the ~$1 billion you claim goes from the feds to the states, a one-time transfer.
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Replying to: srs_49 (Nov 01, 2009 6:18 am) Income skyrocketed as business overwhelmed the reduced number of staff, employees and sales people. When income skyrockets guess who's there first with it's hand out.....the IRS - then the state taxing authorities. Before the drivers of these new vehicles had 1000 miles on the vehicles Uncle Sam was already receiving a good part of the $3 Billion back into the Treasury. Then on Oct 15th businesses had to file their 3rd Qtr tax returns - with payments - which generated another boost to tax revenues. Actually none of the $3 Billion went to the auto makers. The way the system works is that the dealers are required to pay the vehicle maker when the vehicle is shipped from the factory. Now the dealer can floorplan the shipments but once the vehicles left the factories and ports of entry in April, May and June the vehicle makers got paid. The vehicles that were sold in July and August were paid for already in the first 6 months of the year. The vehicle makers got nothing directly from C4C. Now what the vehicle makers did get was empty lots all over the country which allowed them to boost production ( stimulus ) for 4th Qtr. As a result of this boost in production for 4th Qtr additional shifts had to be added and new workers needed to be hired. DING!!! More withholdings going to the US Treasury. But in fact none of the vehicle makers directly received one dime of the C4C program. |
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Replying to: srs_49 (Nov 01, 2009 6:28 am) ..giving the economy a boost now; this has happened ..not sending $3 per gallon ( or more ) to Big Oil and its producing partners over the next 3 or 5 or 7 yrs. The quiet unelected segments of our government that direct much of our actions and those of the lawmakers achieved their goal. $1 to $2 Billion every year now thru 2015 will not be spent on fuel due to these 690,000 clunks being killed off. Since this program worked so well I'm expecting it to be repeated, maybe several times. If they had to use $1+ Billion of C4C stimulus money in order to save the country $5 to $10 Billion in payments for fuel and oil, then that's a profitable 'investment'. Since these segments are unelected and under the radar but have the direct ear of the ones making the laws ( such as CAFE and C4C ) they get what they want.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Nov 01, 2009 7:12 am) Much like a Junkie looking for his next hit of Heroin. Sad way to see US die. Our grandchildren will pay for the auto industries addiction to tax payer bailouts.
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Replying to: gagrice (Nov 01, 2009 7:56 am) You also ignored, missed or did not understand why these types of programs will likely be repeated. It has little or nothing to do with 'bailouts'.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Nov 01, 2009 8:16 am) You are in the minority of people thinking these bailouts are working. 
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Oct 31, 2009 9:13 pm)
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