Cash for Clunkers - Good or Bad Idea?

4110 messages, Last post on Nov 23, 2009 at 11:42 AM

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#1514 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [maryh3] by hpmctorque Jul 09, 2009 (2:18 pm)
Replying to: maryh3 (Jul 09, 2009 7:43 am) Good points, Mary.
#1515 of 4110 Re: I think the Cash for Clunkers Idea [kdhspyder] by andres3 Jul 09, 2009 (2:21 pm)
Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 11:21 am) What lost potential earnings are you talking about and how does this relate to the subject at hand? Lots of potential losses when your throwing 30 billion + down a bottomless money pit. Potential earnings I am talking about could be: 1) putting that 30 billion into investments that pay dividends and interest 2) using some of that money to start a TRULY new car company that will actually make money and pay taxes on earnings due to being profitable. 3) putting that 30 billion into the stock market. 4) putting that 30 billion into a lottery or Las Vegas Casino. 5) giving it back to the "people" in tax rebates 6) giving it to companies that are successful and profitable so that they can expand and grow and become EVEN more profitable and successful. 7) using it for infrastructure that helps improve everyone's productivity. 8) and the list goes on and on. Saving jobs for some is no better than giving people that already have jobs raises equivalent to those lost jobs. If Jack is making $50/hour and Joe is making 0 dollars an hour, that works out the same as if they were both making $25/hour. It's just too bad so sad if Joe isn't keeping up his end of the bargain in helping to run a company into the ground. If Jack has helped a company succeed, I say give them a bailout RAISE.
#1516 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [kdhspyder] by maryh3 Jul 09, 2009 (2:47 pm)
Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 1:58 pm) The government showing favoritism for large corporations over small is simply wrong. I thought the Constitution said something about EQUAL rights? There have been bigger bankruptcies than the Big 2 in the history of the US. Showing favoritism for the UAW based ones is simply wrong again. Here are some that are bigger: http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2009/fortune/0905/gallery.largest_bankruptcies.fo- - rtune/index.html Saving jobs is just fueling the fire. These companies are sucking more out than they put back. The sooner they fall the sooner someone competent can take over. Delaying the inevitable costs more. Haven't we already seen this? Replies to this message: gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 3:37 pm) kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 4:14 pm) dave8697 (Jul 09, 2009 4:39 pm) gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 4:48 pm) and 6 more... british_rover (Jul 09, 2009 4:48 pm) gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 7:32 pm) and 1 more... kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 3:47 pm) hpmctorque (Jul 09, 2009 6:05 pm) kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 7:13 pm) and 67 more... maryh3 (Jul 10, 2009 5:19 am) dtownfb (Jul 10, 2009 9:52 am)
#1517 of 4110 Re: Tangential bit of information [kdhspyder] by maryh3 Jul 09, 2009 (3:21 pm)
Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 12:06 pm) I would actually seriously consider a Volt. Wonder if we will ever see one of them. Bu,t then again, with the government essentially owning GM, I might pass out of spite for the Socialism this represents. Replies to this message: kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 4:18 pm) srs_49 (Jul 10, 2009 2:44 am) steve_ (Jul 10, 2009 7:27 am) maryh3 (Jul 10, 2009 5:44 am) gagrice (Jul 10, 2009 5:54 am) kdhspyder (Jul 10, 2009 9:59 am) and 1 more... dtownfb (Jul 10, 2009 10:03 am) hpmctorque (Jul 10, 2009 2:11 pm) erniesdad (Jul 10, 2009 6:55 am) kdhspyder (Jul 10, 2009 10:45 am) kdhspyder (Jul 10, 2009 11:08 am) and 1 more...
#1518 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [maryh3] by gagrice Jul 09, 2009 (3:37 pm)
Replying to: maryh3 (Jul 09, 2009 2:47 pm) The government showing favoritism for large corporations over small is simply wrong. I thought the Constitution said something about EQUAL rights? This President is anti Constitution. You are beating your head against a wall trying to talk sense into a died in the wool Liberal. They cannot see past their own little world. You want to see real corruption in Politics look at how the stimulus is being handed out. C4C is peanuts compared to the rest of the $800 billion in vote buying dollars. Billions in aid go to areas that backed Obama in '08 By Brad Heath, USA TODAY WASHINGTON — Billions of dollars in federal aid delivered directly to the local level to help revive the economy have gone overwhelmingly to places that supported President Obama in last year's presidential election. That aid — about $17 billion — is the first piece of the administration's massive stimulus package that can be tracked locally. Much of it has followed a well-worn path to places that regularly collect a bigger share of federal grants and contracts, guided by formulas that have been in place for decades and leave little room for manipulation. REPORT: Cities missing out on much needed road funds STIMULUS FUNDS: States aren't using money as intended "There's no politics at work when it comes to spending for the recovery," White House spokesman Robert Gibbs says. Counties that supported Obama last year have reaped twice as much money per person from the administration's $787 billion economic stimulus package as those that voted for his Republican rival, Sen. John McCain, a USA TODAY analysis of government disclosure and accounting records shows. That money includes aid to repair military bases, improve public housing and help students pay for college. Replies to this message: kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 4:14 pm) dave8697 (Jul 09, 2009 4:39 pm) gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 4:48 pm) kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 6:59 pm) and 5 more... british_rover (Jul 09, 2009 4:48 pm) gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 7:32 pm) joegiant (Jul 10, 2009 1:56 am)
#1519 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [maryh3] by kdhspyder Jul 09, 2009 (3:47 pm)
Replying to: maryh3 (Jul 09, 2009 2:47 pm) This is just naive and wrong thinking. Money always has and always will carry more weight. This has always been our history from the very beginning. You focus on the UAW an easy whipping boy. If it was only the UAW then they might actually have let both companies fail and be liquidated. But there is much much more to the picture here. There are all the suppliers to the B2 and all their jobs. Make the B2 disappear and all those jobs are gone too....at least at this time in these economic conditions. Then there are all the downstream jobs that would be affected. Between the B2 there were nearly 10,000 dealerships in NA. If each one only employed 50 people that's 500,000 jobs you've just made disappear. In this depression it's not very smart economics to kill off ... 100,000 direct automotive jobs 100,000 supplier jobs 500,000 downstream jobs Is this really what you're proposing? You wouldn't last very long in any political office if your ideology is slash and burn..cut them jobs, send 'em all home. But by brilliant efforts both companies will survive to get another chance. If the new companies are lean with little or no debt how do you come to the conclusion that they'd be sucking out more than they put back? If they're making vehicles that people are buying that's the definition of productivity. Why should they fail? Replies to this message: hpmctorque (Jul 09, 2009 6:05 pm) kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 7:13 pm) steve_ (Jul 09, 2009 7:28 pm) hpmctorque (Jul 09, 2009 7:42 pm) andres3 (Jul 10, 2009 1:36 pm) and 64 more... maryh3 (Jul 10, 2009 5:19 am) dtownfb (Jul 10, 2009 9:52 am)
#1520 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [gagrice] by kdhspyder Jul 09, 2009 (4:14 pm)
Replying to: gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 3:37 pm) Actually the way I read this article was this. BILLIONS GO TO AREAS THAT DIDN'T SUPPORT OBAMA Can you imagine that?? It's shocking. Here let me set your hair on fire. Not only has Paul Krugman called for more stimulus but so also has the Saint of American Business.... http://www.cnbc.com/id/31828467 Legendary investor Warren Buffett said in an interview aired on Thursday unemployment could hit 11 percent and a second stimulus package might be needed as the economy struggles to recover from recession. Replies to this message: dave8697 (Jul 09, 2009 4:39 pm) gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 4:48 pm) kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 6:59 pm) dodgeman07 (Jul 09, 2009 7:26 pm) and 3 more... gagrice (Jul 10, 2009 5:29 am)
#1521 of 4110 Re: Tangential bit of information [maryh3] by kdhspyder Jul 09, 2009 (4:18 pm)
Replying to: maryh3 (Jul 09, 2009 3:21 pm) Serious question. Will you hold a grudge against GM forever because it begged for Federal assistance? If next year the Feds conduct a successful IPO and we recover all or most of our money and GM 'goes free' will you forgive it? Replies to this message: srs_49 (Jul 10, 2009 2:44 am) steve_ (Jul 10, 2009 7:27 am) maryh3 (Jul 10, 2009 5:44 am) gagrice (Jul 10, 2009 5:54 am) kdhspyder (Jul 10, 2009 9:59 am) dtownfb (Jul 10, 2009 10:06 am) dtownfb (Jul 10, 2009 10:03 am) hpmctorque (Jul 10, 2009 2:11 pm) erniesdad (Jul 10, 2009 6:55 am) kdhspyder (Jul 10, 2009 10:45 am) kdhspyder (Jul 10, 2009 11:08 am) british_rover (Jul 10, 2009 11:18 am)
#1522 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [kdhspyder] by dave8697 Jul 09, 2009 (4:39 pm)
Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 09, 2009 4:14 pm) so out of 787 billion, billions (as in more than 1 billion) have fallen into blue counties?
#1523 of 4110 Re: Someone pays for it. [gagrice] by british_rover Jul 09, 2009 (4:48 pm)
Replying to: gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 3:37 pm) Oh I know I shouldn't but I just can't resist. The current president doesn't respect the Constitution? Seriously you can say that with a straight face err type it I mean. After the past eight years seriously really come on you can't believe that? Can you? Oh god I bet you do. Also I have heard this story reported over and over today but I just don't get it. So cities aren't getting as much stimulus aid as rural areas. but Where is the traditional democratic support base? Let me answer that for you. CITIES Republicans almost always do better in rural areas. Seems to me like the world is upside down. I am going to need to see a lot more data, preferably unmassaged data, before I buy this report. Replies to this message: gagrice (Jul 09, 2009 7:32 pm) joegiant (Jul 10, 2009 1:56 am)