Cash for Clunkers - Good or Bad Idea?

4110 messages, Last post on Nov 23, 2009 at 11:42 AM

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What is this discussion about? Legislation, Truck, Sedan, Wagon, SUV

For questions about how the program works or to discuss program details, please visit our discussion titled, "Cash for Clunkers - Does it Work for You?"

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#1348 of 4110 Re: what effect will this have on used market? [kathyc2] by isellhondas Jul 01, 2009 (6:04 pm)
Replying to: kathyc2 (Jul 01, 2009 2:10 pm) It's easy to give you a 300.00 over invoice price and an unrealistic trade in value when they don't have a car to sell you! Seriously, if they will give you the money you think that Torrent is worth and still sell you a Vibe at 300 over, I wouldn't be picky. I would grab ANY Vibe and run like a thief in the night! I'm very serious because something sounds wrong! Replies to this message: kathyc2 (Jul 02, 2009 10:08 am)
#1349 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [fintail] by chetj Jul 01, 2009 (7:00 pm)
Replying to: fintail (Jul 01, 2009 5:53 pm) i think the program is a very good idea, it should help car sales..i just bought a ohio built G5 and i am very impressed with it has a very smooth ride and the new electronic power steering is great...comes with hands free phone and xm radio too...i hope people consider domestics, the prices are very good and so are the cars...at least look where the car is assembled, we really need to keep jobs in USA..i work at a supplier i should know Replies to this message: chetj (Jul 01, 2009 7:01 pm)
#1350 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [chetj] by chetj Jul 01, 2009 (7:01 pm)
Replying to: chetj (Jul 01, 2009 7:00 pm) the G5 and G6 have big rebates now too
#1351 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [steve_] by chetj Jul 01, 2009 (7:12 pm)
Replying to: steve_ (Jun 30, 2009 6:14 am) well that will help japans economy selling the prius...i know they dont assemble them here
#1352 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [gagrice] by hpmctorque Jul 02, 2009 (2:48 am)
Replying to: gagrice (Jul 01, 2009 1:52 pm) "We are not old enough to have EVER experienced unregulated capitalism. I am not sure that any country has ever tried it." This is very true. The real question is how much regulation and subsidies do we favor? What percentage of our output of goods an services should be allocated to (federal, state and local) governments? Reasonable, intelligent people will differ on the answers to these questions, depending on how much faith, or concern, they have about government and free markets. However, let's all be clear on one thing, and that is there are important tradeoffs for various mixes of government and free market activities. Make no mistake about that. European countries have tended to favor more government involvement in their economies than the U.S. (until recently, at least). As a result, they tend to have more even income distributions, with fewer extremes. One significant tradeoff, however, is that we've traditionally enjoyed a lower unemployment rate, and less structural unemployment. Also, our young people (again, at least until recently, but maybe now too) have found it easier to find employment and to pursue their economic dreams than their European counterparts. Compare the innovation in the U.S. and Europe. Many Americans say the European system is better, but I've met many Europeans who envy what we have. There's probably some "the grass is always greener on the other side" effect here. As I've mentioned several times, I favored the rescue of our financial system, because of the devastation that a financial meltdown would have caused, but I have serious reservations about whether the aid given to GM and Chrysler will be worthwhile in the long run. I tend to doubt it, but will try to keep an open mind until we find out whether these two companies survive, and the cost of saving them is tallied. I tend to think that Chapter 11 or 7 would have been preferable. Other companies would have purchased the assets of these companies that are worth saving. For example, someone would have purchased the Corvette brand, and maybe Chevy, Cadillac and Jeep, if not the others. The number of vehicles sold in the U.S. would not have been materially affected. I'm also not convinced that pouring tens of billions into GM and Chrysler will result in a net reduction in unemployment in the end. Proponents of the bailouts will cite the surge in unemployment that bankruptcies would have caused, and quickly accuse those who favored bankruptcy for GM and Chrysler, and some suppliers, as lacking compassion. It remains to be seem just how compassionate the rescue of GM and Chrysler will turn out to be. It's too early to say whether the jobs saved will, in the end, not be more than offset by the effects associated with the increases in the deficit. Proponents and opponents of more versus less government frequently accuse those that disagree with them of not "getting it." How often have you heard some variation of "conservatives just don't get it...," or liberals just don't get it...." I think it's more a case of people with reasonable intelligence and judgment reaching different conclusions because their priorities differ. Replies to this message: stephen987 (Jul 02, 2009 3:12 am) gagrice (Jul 02, 2009 4:57 am) steve_ (Jul 02, 2009 8:21 am) Mr_Shiftright (Jul 02, 2009 5:59 am)
#1353 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [hpmctorque] by stephen987 Jul 02, 2009 (3:12 am)
Replying to: hpmctorque (Jul 02, 2009 2:48 am) That's a very well thought out post, hp.
#1354 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [hpmctorque] by gagrice Jul 02, 2009 (4:57 am)
Replying to: hpmctorque (Jul 02, 2009 2:48 am) I also agree with your post. I would add, my understanding is that home ownership in most European countries, is a small fraction of the USA. One of the real advantages we had to offer in the past. Seems the house of cards is falling and many will lose their homes built on poor economics. How many will lose their cars when Uncle Sam makes the down payment with the C4C bill? Hopefully the banks are now using sound lending practices that were thrown to the wind over the last decade. The Sub-Prime lending was IMO a direct result of the Feds pushing the lending institutions in a bad direction. Replies to this message: steve_ (Jul 02, 2009 8:21 am)
#1355 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [hpmctorque] by Mr_Shiftright HOST Jul 02, 2009 (5:59 am)
Replying to: hpmctorque (Jul 02, 2009 2:48 am) My favoritism for various bail-out schemes is not really based on compassion at all, but strictly on economics---that it's cheaper to do THIS than to suffer THAT. But yeah, it's very possible the D3 are going into some serious re-structuring in the future and may not be recognizable as the corporations they are today.
#1356 of 4110 Re: what effect will this have on used market? [isellhondas] by andre1969 Jul 02, 2009 (6:16 am)
Replying to: isellhondas (Jul 01, 2009 1:35 pm) These were very slow sellers when new and near impossible to sell as used cars especially now since the recent news about Pontiac. For some twisted reason, I have a soft spot for the Torrent! A few years ago, when a friend of mine wanted to get a new smallish SUV, he narrowed it down to an Xterra and an Equinox. I wanted him to look at the Torrent, because, while it's the same thing, I just thought it had a nicer looking front-end. But the, I'd choose an Astre over a Vega, too! Well, my friend didn't like its look as much as the Equinox. Ended up being a moot point though, because he got the Xterra.
#1357 of 4110 Re: question regarding this program. [dtownfb] by kernick Jul 02, 2009 (7:52 am)
Replying to: dtownfb (Jul 01, 2009 5:10 pm) I can attest that most of these trains are packed. No one said the train(s?) between DC and NYC aren't packed. That does not answer the question - which was "if the trains didn't exist then the roads would be so much more crowded". I want to know how many trains there are X how many passengers on each train, and how this compares to how many people are on the main roads between NYC and DC. So do the trains move 5,000 people per day, and the highways move 100,000/day? what is this ratio? and how much extra capacity is there on the highways? are the highways bumper to bumper 24 hr/day or just around commuting time? Replies to this message: andre1969 (Jul 02, 2009 8:06 am) kernick (Jul 02, 2009 8:13 am) Mr_Shiftright (Jul 02, 2009 9:20 am) hpmctorque (Jul 02, 2009 12:04 pm) dtownfb (Jul 02, 2009 5:16 pm)