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Sedans Acura TL 2009 Acura TL vs Hyundai Genesis
31 messages, Last post on May 30, 2009 at 7:06 AM
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Replying to: skgolfer (Jan 02, 2009 11:51 am)
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Replying to: cebteb (Apr 18, 2009 4:48 pm)
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Replying to: hpmctorque (Apr 26, 2009 3:41 pm) Here in the front range in Colorado, there are lots of grades to drive w/o even venturing into the mountains, so RWD cars are basically summer cars unless you want to use chains (bad idea) or studded snow tires (not legal many places and really lousy to ride on). FWD with all season tires is about the minimum for winter driving here.
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Replying to: cebteb (Apr 27, 2009 10:17 am) Equipping FWD with winter tires should be adequate for most winter driving situations, but your driving needs may indeed require AWD.
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Replying to: cebteb (Apr 27, 2009 10:17 am) Traction and stability control has pretty much fixed those problems. The advantage of FWD cars is that many of them have a 60/40 weight distribution that gives more traction to the drive wheels. If you put 1000 lbs in the trunk of a 2 ton RWD drive car, you can achieve the equivalent 40/60 ratio (not that I would recommend doing that). Of course a 60/40 weight distribution typically induces horrible understeer that degrades cornering ability, but is safer for poor drivers.
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Replying to: hpmctorque (May 04, 2009 1:14 pm) My first bad experience with a RWD here was in 1980 when I ended up doing a 360 on the transition from I225 to I70 during morning rush hour. God was with me as no one hit me. Had an '85 RWD Nissan 300ZX Turbo in winter driving from '85 through '91 with snow tires and sometime light chains. Chains damaged my wheel wells. Had to abandon my car during a snow storm on a local road. No RWD for me here except maybe as a summer car only. Final note, our local newspaper's auto column guy (been in the car business since the 50s) was testing a high priced, European, luxury sedan a couple of years ago in the winter and ripped them in his review because they couldn't get the car out of his driveway due to the slick surface. He ended up getting a different brand vehicle to test that week for his Saturday Drive column.
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Replying to: pafromfl (May 05, 2009 5:57 am) The weight over the drive wheels and the stability of pulling instead of pushing is what make FWD superior to RWD in slick and/or snowy conditions. My first FWD car was a '91 Oldsmobile Omega V6. I know it was a POC, but during the 4 years and 82K miles that it lasted, it pulled me through metro-Denver during the great storm of Christmas 1982. I drove all across town, maybe 40 miles past stuff city buses and delivery trucks as well as hundreds of cars without a problem. My journey didn't end until a quarter mile from my house where I high-centered it in over 3 feet of snow. As my wife always says when the manufacturers come out with another new RWD car, "why do they keep trying to sell those "California" cars in the snow belt and in Colorado". I guess life's lessons need to be relearned by each generation.
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Replying to: cebteb (May 05, 2009 5:52 pm) It is likely that the expensive European sedan wore summer performance tires and had a 50/50 weight distribution. Traction and stability control would have subdued fishtailing if the car ever got enough traction to move. To operate a heavy high-performance (i.e. RWD) car in snow, you need all-season or winter tires. More weight in the trunk yields better traction at the expense of handling.
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Replying to: pafromfl (May 05, 2009 9:07 pm) It also reduces fuel economy and tire wear. I'd consider chains before extra weight. If RWD offers insufficient traction on a frequent basis, then FWD or AWD should be considered. The important factor to consider when selecting a car is that every drive configuration has significant tradeoffs. Therefore, each configuration is a compromise. All too often, buyers don't match their driving requirements with the attributes and drawbacks of the available configurations, and end up with a poor choice. Incidentally, I lived in Wisconsin for many years, so I'm very familiar with winter driving conditions. Unlike Colorado, however, Wisconsin has hills, but no mountains. |
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Replying to: cebteb (May 05, 2009 5:42 pm) Sounds to me like the guy that's been in the business 50 years doesn't know that snow tires were needed. I have generally seen where RWD with snows can't make it up and incline neither can FWD with all-seasons. And I have seen plenty of FWD spin out in the winter. On ice, all bets are off. I drove a European sports sedan for a few years in the snow with all-season tires. I never fishtailed or got stuck. Where you live it sounds like the vehicle of choice is a 4WD Jeep or equivalent. Forget FWD, RWD and AWD.
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