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2009 Suzuki Grand Vitara

68 messages,  Last post on Nov 17, 2009 at 12:10 PM

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#61 of 68 Re: XL7 Dead? [xostnot] by norwoodsmn Jun 21, 2009 (5:13 pm)
Replying to: xostnot (Jun 17, 2009 9:25 pm) Greetings again xostnot.   The XL-7 post I saw said, yes, production had been suspended in September owing to poor sales. Since then however, just within the past week the Co. decided to END production, (period). The North American plant here in Canada where they were built, will now be devoted exclusively to building the new gen Equinox.   I never quibbled with the fact that the Suzuki had as std. equipment, (for instance), a much superior engine to the one available in the Equinox. In many ways I was also pretty sure that the non off roadable gen 2 XL-7 would have been superior to it's root clone vehicle [perhaps] in other ways as well.... In the end however it chiefly came down to brand acceptance, IMO. Had, at any point, any past Suzuki SUV achieved comparable reliability, build quality, etc., etc., stats comparable with that of one of it's respective Toyota or Honda competitors, had the brand ever achieved such a "rep" via earning those credentials, and a "rep" likewise for it's dealer service network, (that wouldn't have hurt either too, would have it...?), with all that in place aforehand, the GM clone might have had some chance to have made it past it's considerable initial teething problems to have made it's mark.. But instead, the handwriting seemed on the wall from the start, to some of us...   If for example, someone had said to me, here: as a freebie you can have either an loaded Equinox, or a ditto, an XL-7, well, [I] am not sure what even [I] would have done. As just one sensible consideration?, for instance, which one might yield the better residual trade in value, and, and, and and.....? As to the mass market, it's pretty clear those unfamiliar with the brand were far more likely to have gone GM, (and did), when having had to actually pay for one themselves. No, don't know what the actual sales stats were, but surely FAR MORE Equinoxes were sold than XL-7's. Yes, there were some model to model differences, but in the end again, it didn't matter. Again therefore another root question remains, was it ever in Suzuki's best interests to make a GM cloned SUV at the expense of abandoning it's niche position of having always had a smaller less expensive SUV model in the lineup? The problem with the prior "little guy" on hand before the NGV appeared, (think the base 4 cyl Vitara), was, it was about as long in the tooth as a beaver which had not chewed wood since the pond thawed.... Ouch!   Now sort of through reverse engineering in a way, of course the new 4 cyl GV for '09 is quasi filling that entry level gap. But a supplemental model new smaller fully modern Jimney/4 door Sidekick sized SUV, would be guaranteed to sell well in the rest of the world, and one would hope, here too as their entry level SUV.   As to an orig gen XL-7, we came very close to having bought [a used one] this past year, after td'ing two of them fairly extensively, but... One pro evaluation of it which I came across stated: they took a mediocre handling vehicle, (the old GV/Vitara/chassis), and made a longer stretched mediocre handling vehicle out of it. I'd have to agree with that asessment completely. So I would have been afraid to have seen what bun might have popped out of the oven, had they based the next gen one on that same tired chassis/suspension setup. Instead, it turned out to be, hey, lets just emulate a GM SUV. Bad karma from the git go.   Again, count me in, as I sure hope they come up with a NEW smaller sized world market entry level model to supplement the NGV in the lineup, before a Chinese knockoff arrives here first. Surely the Suzuki version would be of much greater quality. I quite like the looks of the SX-4 too, but could they make a true bush beater out of it, based on that chassis? Seems the "rig" we may be thinking about here, needs to penned on a clean sheet of paper.    May we live in interesting times..   Nwdsmn.
#62 of 68 More XL7 thoughts by xostnot Jun 21, 2009 (9:09 pm)
My basic reaction to the new XL7 was that it was a blend of minvan and suv. The minivan people would choose to buy something that works even better as a minivan, such as a minivan; while those looking for an suv would choose something more suv-ish, like an suv. No shortage of choices in both. So the XL-7, in attempting to be too many things, ended up bland. Just like the Chrysler Pacifica. Mix many colors of paint and you get grey. People looking for a vehicle just a bit upscale are looking for distinctiveness and specialization, not blandness and versatility.   So the XL7 had quirky styling. Quirky can err on the side of being attractive, like the new Kia Soul; or be quirky unattractive, like the Aztek. The XL7 was quirky/unattractive. Nice engine? Too bad, the neighbours can't see the engine.   Like the Equator, the XL7 may have been relatively cheap to tool up for. But surely the XL7 hasn't repaid the development costs. Maybe Suzuki was desperate to utilize their stake in CAMI. Well, maybe they should have done more research into the styling. I find the Equinox more attractive than the XL7, and the Torrent even more so. They needed something inspired that hung together as do the new GV and the SX4. But no, the XL7 was a mishmash of unrelated styling elements. Surely they could have done better, but instead Suzuki now has another failure on their record.
#63 of 68 '09 Initial quality stats by norwoodsmn Jul 08, 2009 (11:09 am)
Now that's more like it! I'm pleased to note [here] I just saw a news clip re: the J.D. Power and Associates 2009 Initial Quality Study(SM). While there was no individual model data included, of great interest to long time Suzuki fans was the Co's having achieved the honor of showing the greatest degree of improvement of any mfgr for '09, by moving UP from 32nd place in '08, to NINTH IN 2009! Way to go! Of course we'll all have to hope that's not primarily due to their selling Nissan pickups now, (the "Equator"), as I imagine they have to be pretty reliable? Instead lets also hope all those significant '09 upgrades to the GV have been accompanied by like improvements in the area of "gremlin extermination". If so, next up ought to be a maturation of the quality of the dealership network. But any of 'em who survive this current "depression" in the auto industry, ought to be "keepers" thanks to the process of natural selection. But then comes a pretty important question though, how far [then] will you have to drive to have one serviced? Here the marque survives thanks to it's being one of a few different makes sold at the dealership. For stand alone Suzuki dealerships, these truly must be the toughest of times. Looking forward to seeing individual data on the '09 GV's, as time goes on...   Nwdsmn.
#64 of 68 JD Power and Daewoo's by xostnot Jul 08, 2009 (1:35 pm)
I didn't do the analysis myself, but I've read someone's comments that the '09 improvement in Suzuki's JDP reliability rating is because the inclusion of the disastrous Daewoo rebrand models has "timed out".   Unfortunately, Suzuki's Canadian sales for June were down something like 78% over 2008, the worst of all the brands. They aren't typically that bad, though. I haven't heard of any Suzuki dealers closing in the Vancouver area, though no doubt it's not fat city for them. Replies to this message: norwoodsmn (Jul 10, 2009 9:52 am)
#65 of 68 Re: JD Power and Daewoo's [xostnot] by norwoodsmn Jul 10, 2009 (9:52 am)
Replying to: xostnot (Jul 08, 2009 1:35 pm) The Dae-WOE Verona didn't make it to the '07 model year in the US, nor, I think? did it here either? Definitely not in the lineup here in '08. The barest of bare bones Daewoo Swift penalty box was still sold in '08 though, wasn't it, and still now too? Haven't been interested enough to check on that.   Older posts indicated "the real" Suzuki Swift was due here for the 2010 model year. That must still be true as they sure desperately do need it in the lineup. In upmarket form, it's considered a real "pocket rocket" where it is sold in the rest of the world. Adios DaeWOE, asap, and bring us that world market, modern Jimney replacement, when you get around to building it, Suzuki.   Nwdsmn.
#66 of 68 Re: 2009 JA [theguy] by jesb7978 Oct 03, 2009 (10:33 pm)
Replying to: theguy (Apr 11, 2009 6:26 pm) I am considering the 09 GV and have been strongly cautioned not to go through with it due to reliability. I have had a hard time finding anything more than a few specific negatives but Suzukis aren't very prevalent here in the lower 48. I was wondering what you think now that you have had your 09 for almost six months. I appreciate your feedback. Thanks! Replies to this message: xostnot (Oct 15, 2009 6:58 pm)
#67 of 68 Re: 2009 JA [jesb7978] by xostnot Oct 15, 2009 (6:58 pm)
Replying to: jesb7978 (Oct 03, 2009 10:33 pm) If you check Consumers Reports, you'll find the GV is not as good as a Rav4 or CRV for reliability, but like most modern cars it's still pretty good. Some say that CR hates Suzuki and their reviews reflect this. An unbiased source is Michael Karesh's true delta dot com, where the GV is about average.
#68 of 68 2010's, and misc ramblings... by norwoodsmn Nov 17, 2009 (12:10 pm)
All 2010 GV's get standard Navi., which seems yet another tip of Suzuki's hat towards "the mainstream of the marketplace" as they continue to aparently envision same. Without knowing yet, on the other hand I'd venture a guess there will still be no skid plates available as an option for the longer [now] term NGV core customer. Once again, go figure... Suzuki GV value to those core customers is primariarly measured in terms of "trinket content" vs. the availability of "out there doin' it" capable equipment, not even being able as an option...? As an interested observer only at this point, I'd like to hear what NGV loyalists think about that...   Future CUV market leader? Honda has announced a delay in the release of it's next Civic replacement. What does that have to do with CUV pioneer Suzuki? The next Civic model is delayed owing to Honda's decision to make a somewhat smaller, lighter, (and hence obviously more efficient), AND ALSO less costly, (it is claimed), replacement. Hang in there... SO as their Element AND CR-V models are loosely based on the Civic chassis, ditto, those two models will downsize a bit while becomming ever more sophisticated and economical, (it goes without saying). There is no doubt Toyota has to be pondering that info and how it will affect the future of the RAV 4. But what about Suzuki?   The new Kizashi midsized car. Yes, its made it to market, and in its finished form I have to say it looks like a potential winner. Rather than the rad concept version, it looks impressively mainstream but more sporty than the now terminally dull Camry, or the giant Accord. They say its the most important intro in the Co's North American history, and there can be little doubt many marbles are bet on its success. In Europe they will get an "Estate" version, (read: wagon), a config which along with it's available AWD option, well if it ever got here, it would be cool, eh?   So where does all this leave the NGV? Speculating/wishing here, first the sharing of the styling DNA of the successful SX-4 and the new Kizashi mid sized sedan, is obvious to the seasoned observer. So where is [this] going? Imagine a NGV somewhat smaller replacement new CUV based on this chassis, or?, incorporating the SX-4 and Kizashi styling cues, while adding in all of the NGV's toughness and O/R capability. Lots of wishful thinking there?, undoubtably, but it seems pretty clear what the future of the segment will look like once the next gen CR-V hits the road. Smaller, (somewhat), lighter, and hence more efficient and ever more environmentally friendly. Hope Zuke will still be a player with an all new updated, (AND RENAMED), CUV model, (one true to its roots), as the decade ahead unfolds. Nwdsmn.

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