Dodge Dakota Differential problems

4 messages, Last post on Nov 30, 2008 at 6:25 AM

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#3 of 4 Re: 98 Dakota differential problems [dustyk] by ponyks Nov 29, 2008 (7:25 pm)
Replying to: dustyk (Nov 29, 2008 3:07 pm) So, from your comment I gather that: (1) they likely did not DIRECTLY cause this problem (2) by not removing the cover plate, they did not do the mtce as suggested by the manual. Could it be that there was debris that could have been caught had they done it properly? And this debris could have been 'loosened' up by the fluid change, then causing the problem? In other words, the mtce triggered the issue, but it was still normal wear and tear that is the true culprit? If so, then maybe that is why they are offering to pay 100% of the labor + the new fluid, and just charging for the parts (clutches + whatever else totaled $400+). I'm still trying to judge if they are being fair or not. Replies to this message: dustyk (Nov 30, 2008 6:25 am)
#4 of 4 Re: 98 Dakota differential problems [ponyks] by dustyk Nov 30, 2008 (6:25 am)
Replying to: ponyks (Nov 29, 2008 7:25 pm) Pony, So, from your comment I gather that: (1) they likely did not DIRECTLY cause this problem, (2) by not removing the cover plate, they did not do the mtce as suggested by the manual. Yes. Could it be that there was debris that could have been caught had they done it properly? And this debris could have been 'loosened' up by the fluid change, then causing the problem? In other words, the mtce triggered the issue, but it was still normal wear and tear that is the true culprit? Yes, again. However, by just changing the fluid itself I would not expect that any metal particles that had attached to the magnet would become transient again. My suspicions, based on what you've told me, is that they used some sort of device to remove the fluid. My vision is it incorporated some type of suction, and in order to remove all or most of the fluid, a tube would need to be inserted into the differential through the fill hole. I think that inserting a tube into the differential had the potential of dislodging debris from the magnet by mechanical action (the tube coming in contact with the magnet surface knocking off material). This process is not uncommon with those wishing to not disturb the differential cover and going through the time it takes to clean everything up and reseal it. Like I said in my earlier post, its a short cut. If so, then maybe that is why they are offering to pay 100% of the labor + the new fluid, and just charging for the parts (clutches + whatever else totaled $400+). I'm still trying to judge if they are being fair or not. Yes, I think so and I'll tell you why. I worked in this business and I know dealers pretty well. A scrupulous dealer will generally not make any accommodations on repairs unless you are a good customer of the service department AND/OR there was contributory circumstances on their part. In this case, I suspect you rely on this dealer's service department for most of your service needs and have a good rapport with the service staff. Is the dealership being completely honest with you? Well, that is still hard to say. But I suspect they would prefer not to have an indepth discussion on this subject by offering you free labor, and this indicates they have a conscience and believe that there is a possibility they may have caused the problem and that they want to keep you as a customer. The easiest thing to cover by a service manager is the labor. Parts are another story altogether. In this case, if the service manager believes the technician may have caused this problem, he may be forcing the tech. himself to make the repair for free. Or if the tech. is young and new the service department may be covering it. Although this isn't ethical, labor losses can be made up on warranty submissions, if you understand what I'm saying. By the way, even the $400 is cheap. A complete limited slip differential pack is around $700 from Ma Mopar. I'm guessing they are just replacing side (spider) gears, or something else, not clutches. If you've had a good relationship with this dealer and wish to maintain it, you might consider not forcing the issue. It would be hard to actually prove that something they did caused the problem, and if you could it would likely cost you nearly the amount they want to fix the vehicle, not counting lost time and frustration. And in the absence of any other evidence of unethical or professional behavior on the part of this service department, it is, after all, purely possible that it was a complete coincidence. However, I would specify that in the future if any maintenance be done on the differential, that the cover should be removed and the interior components be inspected and the inside of the housing be manual cleaned. Good luck, my friend. Best regards, Dusty

#3 of 4: Re: 98 Dakota differential problems [dustyk] by ponyks; Nov 29, 2008 (7:25 pm)

Replying to: dustyk (Nov 29, 2008 3:07 pm)

So, from your comment I gather that:
(1) they likely did not DIRECTLY cause this problem
(2) by not removing the cover plate, they did not do the mtce as suggested by the manual.

Could it be that there was debris that could have been caught had they done it properly? And this debris could have been 'loosened' up by the fluid change, then causing the problem? In other words, the mtce triggered the issue, but it was still normal wear and tear that is the true culprit?

If so, then maybe that is why they are offering to pay 100% of the labor + the new fluid, and just charging for the parts (clutches + whatever else totaled $400+). I'm still trying to judge if they are being fair or not.

dustyk (Nov 30, 2008 6:25 am)

#4 of 4: Re: 98 Dakota differential problems [ponyks] by dustyk; Nov 30, 2008 (6:25 am)

Replying to: ponyks (Nov 29, 2008 7:25 pm)

Pony,

So, from your comment I gather that: (1) they likely did not DIRECTLY cause this problem, (2) by not removing the cover plate, they did not do the mtce as suggested by the manual.

Yes.

Could it be that there was debris that could have been caught had they done it properly? And this debris could have been 'loosened' up by the fluid change, then causing the problem? In other words, the mtce triggered the issue, but it was still normal wear and tear that is the true culprit?

Yes, again. However, by just changing the fluid itself I would not expect that any metal particles that had attached to the magnet would become transient again. My suspicions, based on what you've told me, is that they used some sort of device to remove the fluid. My vision is it incorporated some type of suction, and in order to remove all or most of the fluid, a tube would need to be inserted into the differential through the fill hole. I think that inserting a tube into the differential had the potential of dislodging debris from the magnet by mechanical action (the tube coming in contact with the magnet surface knocking off material). This process is not uncommon with those wishing to not disturb the differential cover and going through the time it takes to clean everything up and reseal it. Like I said in my earlier post, its a short cut.

If so, then maybe that is why they are offering to pay 100% of the labor + the new fluid, and just charging for the parts (clutches + whatever else totaled $400+). I'm still trying to judge if they are being fair or not.

Yes, I think so and I'll tell you why. I worked in this business and I know dealers pretty well. A scrupulous dealer will generally not make any accommodations on repairs unless you are a good customer of the service department AND/OR there was contributory circumstances on their part. In this case, I suspect you rely on this dealer's service department for most of your service needs and have a good rapport with the service staff.

Is the dealership being completely honest with you? Well, that is still hard to say. But I suspect they would prefer not to have an indepth discussion on this subject by offering you free labor, and this indicates they have a conscience and believe that there is a possibility they may have caused the problem and that they want to keep you as a customer.

The easiest thing to cover by a service manager is the labor. Parts are another story altogether. In this case, if the service manager believes the technician may have caused this problem, he may be forcing the tech. himself to make the repair for free. Or if the tech. is young and new the service department may be covering it. Although this isn't ethical, labor losses can be made up on warranty submissions, if you understand what I'm saying.

By the way, even the $400 is cheap. A complete limited slip differential pack is around $700 from Ma Mopar. I'm guessing they are just replacing side (spider) gears, or something else, not clutches.

If you've had a good relationship with this dealer and wish to maintain it, you might consider not forcing the issue. It would be hard to actually prove that something they did caused the problem, and if you could it would likely cost you nearly the amount they want to fix the vehicle, not counting lost time and frustration. And in the absence of any other evidence of unethical or professional behavior on the part of this service department, it is, after all, purely possible that it was a complete coincidence. However, I would specify that in the future if any maintenance be done on the differential, that the cover should be removed and the interior components be inspected and the inside of the housing be manual cleaned.

Good luck, my friend.

Best regards,
Dusty