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50 Worst Cars of All Time

298 messages,  Last post on May 11, 2009 at 1:53 PM

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What is this discussion about? Automotive News, Classic Cars, Coupe, Convertible, Truck, Sedan, Wagon


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#48 of 298
Re: Another Malcolm Bricklin Worst Car Contender [lokki] by fezo
Nov 18, 2008 (11:58 am)
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Replying to: lokki (Nov 18, 2008 10:53 am)

Great list. Sure I'd quibble with a few but it's pretty solid.
 
The Yugo - a Fiat without he legendary Italian reliability.
#49 of 298
Re: If ya wanna get picky... [captain2] by fintail
Nov 18, 2008 (12:04 pm)
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Replying to: captain2 (Nov 18, 2008 10:06 am)

The Kadett has even more heritage than that, it's a prewar name - the tooling for the car was stolen by the Soviets and was the platform for a Moskovitch. I think the old 50s-70s Opels still kicking around in NA have at least a minor cult following.
 
Opel today has a lot more reputation for respectable products than what GM has made on this continent for the past 30 years or so.
#50 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [grbeck] by Mr_Shiftright HOST
Nov 18, 2008 (1:08 pm)
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Replying to: grbeck (Nov 18, 2008 11:52 am)

I guess what I meant was that the Vega had an effect on GM history but not directly on automotive history, like say the VW bug or the Corvair for that matter. I suppose one could logically argue that any effect on GM history is an effect on automotive history, but it's not so direct or apparent.
 
What I remember most about the Vega was the ugly labor/union/plant problems they had around the car.
#51 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [Mr_Shiftright] by grbeck
Nov 18, 2008 (1:31 pm)
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Nov 18, 2008 1:08 pm)

Among my car-conscious friends in the mid-1970s (and we weren't even in senior high school yet), the Vega had a bad reputation for premature engine failure and severe rust problems.
#52 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [Mr_Shiftright] by andre1969
Nov 18, 2008 (2:23 pm)
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Nov 18, 2008 1:08 pm)

I think back in those days, small cars were enough of a fringe (yes, even in the 1970s), that botches such as the Corvair, Vega and its offshoots, and the Chevette, really didn't hurt GM. For the most part, people expected small cars to be cheap, unreliable, a compromise. Now once the Japanese imports started showing that it WAS possible to make a halfway decent small car, it was eroding GM's market share in that area. But GM's strength in those days was in larger cars and trucks.
 
I think the biggest blow to GM was the 1980 Citation and its siblings. 1980 was the year that everything really changed. Suddenly, the midsized and full-sized cars weren't the heart of the market anymore. It was shifting to the compact. In that extra-long 1980 model year, the Citation sold over 800,000 units. Throw the Omega, Phoenix, and Skylark in the mix and you have probably another 700,000 units. So that's 1.5 Million cars total. Chevrolet sold 2.29 million total cars that year. Ford sold about half that, and nobody else broke a million, although Oldsmobile was probably close.
 
Well, the X-car went on to become one of the most recalled cars in history, and proved that GM was capable of burning customers not just on the low end, but right in the heart of the market. I think they're still reeling from that one. After all, everybody expected cheap domestic economy cars to let you down, but I don't think anybody thought it would come from the mainstream.
#53 of 298
Re: If ya wanna get picky... [fintail] by captain2
Nov 18, 2008 (2:53 pm)
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Replying to: fintail (Nov 18, 2008 12:04 pm)

yeah, and Opel has been owned by GM since the 30s! You would have thought that back in theose days when GM was demonstrating to everybody that they couldn't build anything but V8 engined gas hogs ( and still can't?) , that there was a lot to learn from those Germans over at Opel. Cars like the Corvair, the Monza, the Citation, as well as the Chevette could have been so much more adn maybe the US mfgrs. wouldn't have had to 'give' the car industry to the Japanese.
#54 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [andre1969] by graphicguy
Nov 18, 2008 (3:57 pm)
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Replying to: andre1969 (Nov 18, 2008 2:23 pm)

Towards the end of the tenure of cars like the "X-platforms" and the Pontiac Fiero, they were actually pretty good cars. That's not meant to absolve GM for those blunders. Just that they didn't put enough development time into them until the damage was irreversible. They may have turned into good cars, it was just too little, too late.
 
However, Cimmeron was just a bad idea, from start to finish. Isn't Mercedes the developer and the manufacturer of the "Smart" car? I predict that one will go down in the automotive annals as a great blunder, too.
 
And honestly, are there really that many differences between a VW and an Audi (at least base models)? Speaking of VW/Audi, how's about the Phaeton?
#55 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [graphicguy] by boomchek
Nov 18, 2008 (4:03 pm)
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Replying to: graphicguy (Nov 18, 2008 3:57 pm)

I was going to say...... I wouldn't touch an old (90s) VW, Audi, or Land Rover with a 10 foot pole or a full warranty that pays me for the suffering endured as well while the cars are in the shop.
#56 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [graphicguy] by andre1969
Nov 18, 2008 (4:15 pm)
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Replying to: graphicguy (Nov 18, 2008 3:57 pm)

Towards the end of the tenure of cars like the "X-platforms" and the Pontiac Fiero, they were actually pretty good cars. That's not meant to absolve GM for those blunders. Just that they didn't put enough development time into them until the damage was irreversible. They may have turned into good cars, it was just too little, too late.
 
Yeah, from what I've heard, by 1983 the X-cars were pretty much up to "average" in the CR ratings, which was about as good as it got out of a domestic in those days. And for some reason, the Buick Skylark didn't suffer the same stigma that the others did. The Phoenix and Omega became such losers that they were dropped a year earlier, in 1984, their names never to rise from the ashes again. The Citation did make it through 1985, but once it was gone, its name was retired as well. The Skylark managed to sell about 100,000 units in 1985, which was fairly impressive considering the stigma the X got. And the name still had enough equity to get carried over to the 4-door version of the Somerset Regal. And before too long, they called the coupe Skylark as well.
 
And when you figure the A-body (Century, Ciera, 6000, Celebrity) was based on it, and some of those made it up through 1996, that showed the platform had potential.
#57 of 298
Re: Chrysler/DeSoto Airflow [grbeck] by jj2me
Nov 18, 2008 (4:54 pm)
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Replying to: grbeck (Nov 18, 2008 1:31 pm)

I bought a new 1971 Vega, the Motor Trend Car of the Year for 1971. My first new car. I babied it, changed the oil and filter every 2,500 miles. Nevertheless, it went through two engines in 65,000 miles (one lasted 35K, the other 30K), both suffering from excessive oil consumption (a quart every 75 miles).
 
Aluminum block, cast iron head, for cost-cutting reasons. Good cars have the reverse. The Vega's block had no cylinder sleeves, just treated aluminum.
 
Exterior surface rust showed within the first 90 days.
 
By 1974, they had cured the engine problems (sleeves added).
 
The next GM car I bought was a ..., uh, no, I haven't yet bought a GM car since then.
 
In contrast, I knew a Chevette owner with more than 100,000 miles, and one with over 150K.
 
The early Vega with its tissue-paper engine must surely be one of the 50 worst cars of all time.

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