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Automotive News & Views Do You Favor A Government Loan To The Detroit 3?
3958 messages, Last post on Oct 02, 2009 at 4:52 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Nov 23, 2008 1:22 pm) All the GM brands I can sort of understand. They purchased some good brands as the industry consolidated. But then they wound up homogenizing them. Honda/Acura, VW/Porsche, Nissan/Infiniti - every time I see one of the premium brands, I have to wonder if there's really any special engineering or higher quality components to justify the premium cost or is it all just window dressing. Lattes in the service department don't excite me, although a loaner is nice. And there underlies the argument for letting GM reorganize so they can dump brands and dealers instead of financing more of the same on taxpayer dollars.
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Replying to: steve_ (Nov 23, 2008 1:56 pm) It maybe changing with some of GM's latest offerings, but I think the German and Asian makes have done a better job of differentiating the product between premium and nonpremium brands. Drive a G35 and you now it's not a run of the mill Nissan. They may both have the corporate 3.5v6, but they tune them specifically for each line they are used in. In my experience, when I'm in a VW it feels like an Audi. Where as, when I've been in a Buick it feels like a Chevy. Meaning that many of the switch gear and interior materials in the VW, wouldn't look out of place in a an Audi. The Buick's I've been in had switch gear that felt and looked to cheap to even be in a Cavalier. That's been the problem. Granted, GM's latest offerings have much, much better interior design and materials. |
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Replying to: steve_ (Nov 23, 2008 1:56 pm) I believe there are. We have a 2004 Buick Ranier, and it is MUCH better, quieter and more luxurious than the Chevy or GMC. Buick adds it's "Quiet Tuning", which adds more insulation and has (extra???) laminated glass to give it a much quieter ride. Also, it is AWD as opposed to push button 4WD. What I resent is how the Foreign companies seem to get a free pass in doing this, yet the Big 3 are called to task for it. Ironically, I believe had Daimler Chrysler engaged in more of this, it would've been a much leaner company and there would be no reason for the Germans to dump Chrysler. Instead, they chose to treat Chrysler as a red headded stepchild, and it cost them large sums of money (not enough in my mind). Unfortunately, it will probably cost Chrysler it's life.
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Nov 23, 2008 5:42 pm) Continuing in this vein, this commentator at the Washington Post says that the Big 3's problem is that can't "gain access quickly to cutting-edge components developed throughout the group -- and find new ways to integrate them into new product." And then he says that Lexus stuff trickles down to the Camry. But did Lexus stuff migrate down or did Toyota just add extra Dynamat and heavier glass to the Lexus and get a free pass for doing so? Now CITI gets bailed out - why not Detroit? |
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Now the TV Networks are saying they need to be bailed out. They have been losing advertising over the last two decades. Now as Automakers cut back on Advertising it will be devastating to them as well. I cannot think of a better thing to happen in this country than for TV stations to go broke and quit broadcasting. There is NOTHING on TV worth the electricity to watch it. 2009 may be a banner year yet. Get rid of junky automakers and network TV. http://www.variety.com/VR1117996347.html
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Replying to: steve_ (Nov 23, 2008 7:34 pm) Because I sold my GM at $27 and I bought Citi Group when I thought it had bottomed out. I was going to buy more at under $4. Probably too late. There is a BIG difference between keeping the money sound and subsidizing automakers that are not going to be profitable. Giving a loan is bad enough. We are talking a gift to GM. That is anti business. Why not every other automaker building cars in the USA. If we subsidize GM we should subsidize Toyota as well. They are both multi national corporations. How do we know that GM has not siphoned off billions here to build up their China operations? Then tell the public we are hurting and it is all because we were stupid and promised our UAW employees the moon. |
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From the looks of this photo essay, it looks as though Detroit is just about to become one big park. Best to bulldoze all the buildings and get a grant from the National Park Service. Give it back to the pigeons and coyotes. Detroit is far greener than most major cities, as seen in the runaway vines swarming old mansions in Brush Park, trees sprouting from the rooftops of skyscrapers, tallgrass fields encircling the lone house still standing on a residential block, and abandoned homes swallowed by shrubs thriving unchecked. Whole neighorhood blocks cleared of houses by arson and bulldozers have reverted to urban prairies, visible in satellite photos as unusually large green patches in the middle of the inner city. Sidewalks vanish beneath creeping grasses, while aluminum fences between homes become entwined with the branches of dozens of saplings growing as high as the droopy utility wires. Alleys in parts of the city start resembling hiking trails as growth from the yards on both sides narrows their width. All around town, even smaller empty lots become thick, grassy fields, because the City doesn’t often mow in easements and right-of-way areas, allowing weeds to grow 3 feet high. Throughout Detroit, as half the population fled in the last half-century outward towards the suburbs and later towards more rural areas, the city itself has, ironically, become more rural, with wild animals and lush green plants coexisting with an industrial, modern metropolis. http://www.detroitblog.org/?p=287
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Replying to: steve_ (Nov 23, 2008 7:34 pm) The Lexus stuff was always in Toyota. They started "decontenting" (another word for cheapening), Toyota and made us believe Lexus was higher quality. Look back at the Toyota Cressida, that was the precursor of Lexus imho.
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Replying to: gagrice (Nov 23, 2008 9:20 pm) Too much violence and too many stupid reality TV shows and infomercials. As for the news media, how many stations do we need repeating the same news at the same time? Maybe the market can no longer sustain so many TV networks and local stations. Yes.... lets blame that on GM and the banking industry too. 
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Replying to: gagrice (Nov 23, 2008 9:42 pm) I went to the Michigan State Fair long ago while visiting in Detroit while working in Michigan. A grad school acquaintance worked for Ford during the summer and he showed me around the town. It's amazing what incompetent management and city leaders can do for a town while expecting handouts from others and giving themselves the benefits through the decades. The recent mayor got caught. Who's the mayor now? Do they have city leaders willing to make residents behave? Or is it more of the same lifestyle? |
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