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Automotive News & Views Do You Favor A Government Loan To The Detroit 3?
3958 messages, Last post on Oct 02, 2009 at 4:52 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Nov 22, 2008 12:20 am) A friend of mine's dad used to fly a corporate jet for Midwest Steel in northwest Indiana in the late 80's. I don't know if they are still in business. I'd guess like most of the steel mills running in that area now, most have gone BK and are operating under different management. |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Nov 22, 2008 12:20 am) Aditya Mittal has been flying around in a private jet, and it sounds like the jet has been around for a decade. (link). Midwest Steel is still around (assuming it's the same outfit?). They made the steel used to rebuild the GM factory that was flattened by a tornado in OK and made the steel for the Toyota factory in San Antonio. One of my relations works for Nucor Steel. "In August 2006, the company did purchase a corporate jet for use by senior management. In a letter to all employees from the CEO, Dan DiMicco explained that the frequent rentals of charter jets made a corporate jet purchase a cost-effective measure." (Wiki) Nucor has its roots in Oldsmobile btw. I can just see Wagoner sitting in first class and having some Vega or Cimarron owner recognize him and start slugging away, especially after last week's performance.  Obama gave a short radio talk this morning and mentioned fuel-efficient cars, but nothing about a bailout. link title
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Replying to: steve_ (Nov 22, 2008 8:43 am) I think Obama knows that letting the Big 3 die is the best way to start fresh with a new era of EVs and fuel efficient cars. The Big 3 cannot build high mileage inexpensive cars for the masses with their corporate bloat. They can only survive if the buying public goes back to buying Tahoes and Explorers. I don't see that happening anytime soon. I would look to the Chinese to own most of Michigan before too long. Minnesota is close by and grows the best wild rice. It's a natural. 
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Blame Steve, one of the hosts, for this post. He linked this discussion in a Hummer post. Love links to positions that show the post is more than an emotional response. Think the problem is endemic to a consumerist society driven by greed, no regulations please-I got mine go get yours, unless something happens and need to cry like a stuck pig for government programs to help me - that statement is an emotional response to red individuals who talk tough until it hurts them specifically. Yes, American ceos seem grossly overpaid compared to known payments of Japanese executives - been so for a long time. Don't pay to enrich pro athletes either (small local teams popping up all over the area-can't get into the majors or just love to play, hope it is the latter). Saw the evening news and the new honda plant in IN making civics, earn less then union wages and saw mostly young faces and what looked like Japanese managers mixed in the crowd watching the Honda Executive give his speech. I have worked with an older man who was happy to work because he just came from WV earning fifty cents an hour-1979 if I remember correctly. Worked a summer in a seamless tube mill and spent some time on the PA Turnpike decades ago(this is for steve's comment). Instead of a rational approach to growth, Levittown consumed farmland to make money by building houses of sticks and houses are still being built with sticks and plywood if it is available.. Loans, why not. Bankruptcy-is that to break more unions. Ronald was a union hater possibly because of a preceived injustice to him. So he broke the air traffic controllers and the few overworked controllers are still sending out the alarm. A. Jackson, an anti-Hamiltonian, broke the first BUS and Biddle. How would you like to bring back red dog banking. Recessions and worse until the final straw when regulations protected us (under FDR) until this latest round of deregulation and money grabbing. Worked in sales awhile back, the owner was once an airplane mechanic until...cheaper bodies could be found who couldn't read. An now an amusing incident, was coming out of a parts store and noticed a guy wiring under the hood and was suprised a new truck had a wiring issue. He had wired up his own trailer hitch and had a problem. So he said he did what he does at work-put in a piece of heavy copper wire and see what melts then wire around it. His occupation-aircraft mechanic, says those old planes have been worked on so much blueprints are useless. The personal auto is the result of corporate and government cooperation? destroying mass transit decades ago. Even Jay Leno made a comment of the danger of lost technology. Why do think the Chinese demanded the technology to build vehicles. I have done several industrial and technical jobs before that BS diploma. Things would not work without the passing down of specific information from one person to the next about that job, product, method. Give them the loan - where are the trillions the current ins have given away or are you still listening to those fear mongerers on the radio misdirecting your emotions. |
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Some might say that it is immoral to take money from the tax payer to give to a failed enterprise. This means any failed enterprise, AIG to GM. Some might say that Socialism punishes: 1. Hard Work 2. Thrift 3. Entrepreneurship Is this the Road To Serfdom and do we really want to proceed down this road? Should the government have bailed out the buggy whip manufacturers at the turn of the last century? Some might say let Creative Destruction take place and the economic resources will be reallocated to their most efficent use by the millions of participants in the market. Was it freedom or Socialism that provided the US with the highest standard of living in the history of human civilization?
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 All new for 2012, the Pelosi GTxi SS/Rt Sport Edition is the mandatory American car so advanced it took $100 billion and an entire Congress to design it. We started with same reliable 7-way hybrid ethanol-biodeisel-electric-clean coal-wind-solar-pedal power plant behind the base model Pelosi, but packed it with extra oomph and the sassy styling pizazz that tells the world that 1974 Detroit is back again -- with a vengeance. We've subsidized the features you want and taxed away the rest. With its advanced Al Gore-designed V-3 under the hood pumping out 22.5 thumping, carbon-neutral ponies of Detroit muscle, you'll never be late for the Disco or the Day Labor Shelter. Engage the pedal drive or strap on the optional jumbo mizzenmast, and the GTxi SS/Rt Sport Edition easily exceeds 2016 CAFE mileage standards. At an estimated 268 MPG, that's a savings of nearly $1800 per week in fuel cost over the 2011 Pelosi. Even with increased performance we didn't skimp on safety. With 11-point passenger racing harnesses, 15-way airbags, and mandatory hockey helmet, you'll have the security knowing that you could survive a 45 MPH collision even if the GTxi SS/Rt were capable of that kind of illegal speed. But the changes don't stop there. Sporty mag-style hubcaps and an all-new aggressive wedge shape designed by CM's Chief Stylist Ted Kennedy slices through the wind like an omnibus spending bill. It even features an airtight undercarriage to keep you and a passenger afloat up to 15 minutes -- even in the choppy waters of a Cape Cod inlet. Available a rainbow of color choices to match any wardrobe, from Harvest Avocado to French Mustard. Inside, a luxurious all-velour interior designed by Barney Frank features thoughtful appointments like in-dash condom dispenser and detachable vibrating shift knob. A special high capacity hatchback holds up to 300 aluminum cans, meaning fewer trips to the redemption center. And the standard 3 speaker Fairness ActoPhonic FM low-band sound system means you'll never miss a segment of NPR again. Best of all, the Pelosi GTxi SS/Rt is made right here in the U.S.A. by fully card-checked unionized workers and Detroit's famous visionary jet-set managers. Even if you don't own one, you can enjoy the patriotic satisfaction that you're supporting the high wages, good benefits, and generous political donations that are once again making the American car industry the envy of the world. But why not buy one anyway? With an MSRP starting at only $629,999.99, it's affordable too. Don't forget to ask about dealer incentives, rebates, tax credits, and wealth redistribution plans for customers from dozens of qualifying special interest groups. Plus easy-pay financing programs from Fannie Mae. There is more
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Replying to: rangerover2 (Nov 20, 2008 5:03 pm) What are you talking about? Both China and India were closed economies (and - if we go that far back in history - so was Japan). It was the US who forced them open, with the "Capitalism is good" mantra. Now that they compete with US, and parts of US economy cannot compete with them, you want to change the rules? In the last five years, US has completely lost its moral high ground. I live in Japan, and remember the sermons that US preached to the Japanese Govt in later 90s about how to let the "weak go under" for the greater good, and now we have US bailing out anything that is still breathing. So please, please - Take any line of argument, but THAT
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Replying to: gagrice (Nov 22, 2008 10:54 am) Be a nice yard ornament for Mrs. Tired Old Dave eh? |
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Replying to: bpraxis (Nov 22, 2008 10:15 am) Libertarians would probably say that's your problem I got mine go find yours somewhere else. Modern Society is represented by interdependency. We don't build our own log cabins, dig wells, kill and butcher animals, plant crops, fix the ague with homemade cures, gin our cotton and weave on our looms. The last bubble started after ww2, capitalists rebuilt the axis while our infrastructure, save Ike's interstates patterned after the PA Turnpike and the autobahn, was left to wither on the vine. The final deregulation provided for our comsumptive societal system to be fed with borrowed international money. The CN$ climbed and retreated, the yen has just climbed and retreated a little. Unless all world currencies can be debased like the fiat dollar, perhaps hyperinflation is around the corner and everyone will be gnashing their teeth. Did you get yours while the gettin was good. So what harm is a little loan compared to the trillions wasted on armament. There was a shortage of ammo not too long ago. Without a textile industry where are fatigues sewn. Hardness strengths on bolts that are true, weak Brazilian steel, and a veteran of LBJ/Nixon's war recently saw the label on a package of his underwear - made in Vietnam. |
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