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Automotive News & Views Do You Favor A Government Loan To The Detroit 3?
3958 messages, Last post on Oct 02, 2009 at 4:52 PM
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Replying to: dieselone (Dec 14, 2008 10:26 am) We tend to harp on reliability of the D3, but when you get right down to it, it is as much about quality of the product as reliability. VW is well known to have mediocre to poor reliability, and their cost of repair is high. Yet they retain their value quite well compared with most D3 vehicles. Why is that? IMHO it is because they are beautifully crafted inside, and they drive with precision. They are very desirable (but perhaps not reliable) vehicles. The D3 vehicles are all over the map on reliability, but how many are highly desirable? Not many. The D3 should put together some premium vehicles with refinement, quality interiors, and smooth engines that also look good. Charge a few grand more. The customers will notice.
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Replying to: dieselone (Dec 14, 2008 10:26 am) Shoot, I'd rather walk than trust anything from VW again. I don't care how nice a VW interior is or how great the ergonomics are if the car is going to be in the shop every other Tuesday or leave me stranded in some god-forsaken place. My ex-girlfriend's Jetta wasn't the only bad one I've seen. A friend and I were riding in his brother's Rabbit when we heard this horrible thud and the left rear of the car suddenly collapsed. The shock absorber broke right through the tower! Another friend bought a new 2000 Jetta. It was plagued with so many electrical and transmission problems, he dumped it at a loss for a 2001 Saturn. Another friend bought a new Scirocco back in the 1980s and it was delivered with mismatched taillamp lenses and the driver's seat collapsed. Don't forget the horrid Dasher which I refer to as the Trasher. |
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Replying to: tlong (Dec 14, 2008 2:27 pm) |
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Replying to: lemko (Dec 14, 2008 2:29 pm) It's funny how different people come away with completely opposite experiences regarding the vehicles we discuss. Like I've said I've put lots of miles on my grandpa's cars over the years. I disliked everyone of his Buick's. When he passed in '03, his '00 Park Ave went to my parents. I volunteered to drive that car from Tampa to the Chicago area. The car wreaked of cheapness and questionable build quality. I liked the exterior looks, but the interior was terrible. I loved driving 1200 miles with windshield wipers that would turn on by themselves, the fuel gauge that sometimes worked and sometimes didn't. That was the type of car I'd rather ride in than drive, because of numb steering, brakes, and nausea inducing float. But I know my grandpa loved that kind of ride. As for VW, When I bought my '00 Jetta TDI, my BIL also bought a '00 Jetta GLS, and my uncle bought a '00 Passat GLS. These were all manual trans cars, but only my uncle had any issues, but they were not severe enough for him to dump the car as he still has it. I only kept my Jetta about a year, but I put 35k miles on it w/o any issues. My BIL kept his Jetta 3 years w/o any trouble and he traded that in on an '03 Passat. He drove than about 3 years and zero problems with it. I know VW has had issues as I've read about them, but from my experience they are not all bad. Which is similar to your experience with GM. The opposite of mine.
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Replying to: lemko (Dec 14, 2008 2:29 pm) A friend had a Jetta, maybe 2001. The windows fell down unexpectedly. The check engine light kept coming on. The closer Cincinnati dealer treated them like crap--didn't want to work on their own brand of car. So he kept taking to the purchase dealer about 15 miles further away in Fairfield. They'd keep the car and get the light off and then return it. Big nuisance. I've never had falling windows and check engine lights erratically on in my GM products. Two years ago they traded the monster--for the VW Bug that his wife wanted. They had it in for service and there was something that was going to require $780 of cost so he traded it instead... grin  . His wife had a bug in her younger days so she liked the idea of another one and she doesn't like to drive large cars like their Pacifica..
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Replying to: dieselone (Dec 14, 2008 10:26 am) As for GM cars of 2000, consider me masochistic, but I could actually go for a Park Ave! I like the Bonneville too, although I'm not too crazy about their interiors. The LeSabre doesn't really do much for me, but I could deal with it. I like the Cadillac Seville, but I'd worry about repair costs on the Northstar as it ages (I'd probably be concerned with any luxury car from that era though) My Dad has a 2003 Regal, which is the same as a 2000. I don't think it's a bad car, but it's just not that stellar, either. The interior is pretty bad, and the fit-and-finish so-so (which is actually a compliment for a W-body of that era...I've seen much worse!). It also has a cramped back seat. I think the Grand Prix sedan from 1997-2003 was really good looking, but just too small inside for my tastes (that swoopy body cut down room more than in the sister divisions' models), and again, the interior bothered me. I like the Olds Intrigue as well, but have reservations about the 3.5 OHC V-6. I think it was a bit more troublesome compared to say, the 3.8. I guess there's really nothing from that lineup that's lust-worthy, but if you can find a nice, well-maintained one, you might be able to get a lot of life out of it.
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Replying to: driver100 (Dec 14, 2008 10:11 am) Lexus really destroyed MB's pricing ambitions - from the time the LS was a bonafide hit and the 1992 ES was popular, MB had to knock down the margins. The cheapness of the lower line models of the 1994+ C-class were the first hint. Today there is little difference in price between sticker on a 2009 S550 and the original sticker on a 1992 500SEL. I doubt this is what the MB braintrust wanted. |
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Replying to: lemko (Dec 14, 2008 2:36 pm) I happen to have an 03 Accord V6. I would like to know what GM car you think would have been a better choice (for $25k)? My wife was rear-ended, and the Accord was in the shop for a week. We were given an 06 Impala as a rental. The Impala was three years younger than my Accord, with half as many miles (15k vs 30k), but it felt and rode like it was older. Everything about the Impala was inferior to the Accord, from highway stability, to performance and craftsmanship. It's actually hard for me to put Impala, and craftsmanship, in the same sentence, because they have nothing to do with each other. I could not wait to get my Accord back, so it could remind me what "Quality" is again.
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Replying to: fintail (Dec 14, 2008 9:03 am) Well if enough people decide they will "do what's right, instead of dwelling on the past and wanting payback, then the general populace might question what the heck both the Rep & Dem are doing, and vote for candidates in a 3rd party. I agree that there is a great transfer of wealth and power to the wealthy and political establishments in this country. When people realize that we need to stop giving $$$ to the government to further enrich and empower themselves, then maybe we can break this Dem-Rep path that will destroy the greatness of this country. But as long as some of us keep supporting these government policies because we're getting something, like giving $10 in taxes, and then fighting, and being happy we got $8 back, then we're in trouble. We do not need the government going into debt further, and we do not need the government managing private sector companies.
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Yes today because we have to. We will probably always need good trucks. No tomorrow because society's model is wrong. Was it early Greek thought that stated cities should be about two hundred and fifity thousand residents. Enough population where specialization could occur but not so large as to become a rat cage. And then interconnect these towns for sharing of culture, products, and gene pool. What if today we lived on barren land, farmed the arable soil, and lived without wasting our time on personal transportation. How much have we lost individually and as a society by messing with auto's to go here and there. |
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