Last post on Jan 11, 2010 at 9:10 AM
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#53 of 58 Re: Kelley Blue Book [lazzinaro]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Jan 08, 2010 (6:38 pm)
I think Porsche is a lot like Elvis was---basically "critic-proof". It didn't matter what he produced, how good, how bad, how indifferent, how brilliant---it just sold on past reputation and loyalty. Of course, I do hope Porsche has a happier ending. Ditto Ferrari.
Porsche REALLY had to go out of its way to annoy people (can you say 924?) as did Ferrari (400i).
Now it is true that if you keep doing bad stuff that *eventually*, despite the greatest reputation in the world, you can't rest on your laurels forever. Rolls Royce rested on them for at least 40 years and nobody seemed to mind as long as it said RR on the hood. So too Cadillac, which will never regain its former lustre.
I think Porsche USA sales of *all* models is about the same as Corvette. Something in the low to mid 30,000 range.
Much of this is the Boxster I'm sure, which is why the older ones are dirt cheap now, well under $10,000 and falling fast.
Porsche seems to be just getting better and so is Corvette---so I'm not worried about either--unless Big Daddy GM goes under for good (a distinct possibility).
Oh, no, a Chinese Corvette?!! The horror!
Jan 10, 2010 (4:59 pm)
desirability and (perceived) reliability on scales of 1-10, very few volume automakers get much beyond 10. But those who get to 10 or so have the best resale. An extra point is scored for not having fleet sales of course.
Toyota - desirability - 2, reliability - 8. (for example)
Porsche - desirability - 10, reliability - 5? (and no fleet sales )
Probably explains why it is so expensive buying a 75,000-mile Boxster!! ($15-20K doesn't seem dirt cheap Shifty, for a 7-8 year old Boxster that will be pushing 100K in a couple of short years. Relatively inexpensive for a Porsche? Sure).
#55 of 58 Re: if you score [nippononly]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Jan 10, 2010 (6:59 pm)
Here's a '2000 model for $9900 asking, with 93K miles on it. They are really dirt cheap these days. I'm sure you could get this car for $9K. maybe less. People are *dying* out there. Just look how this ad reads. Guy needs to sell.
I did a quick scan for "Boxster" on craigslist (just on craigslist), and only for the San FRancisco Bay Area, and I got 82 hits right off.
Porsche reliability is actually *very good*, especially the newer ones. Better than the other Germans I'd say. At least an 8.5. Maybe BMW is an 8, Benz a 7.5, VW a 5?4? Right up there with Range Rover
Yeah, 97--'98 Boxster---not such a good idea to buy one of those.
#56 of 58 Re: Kelley Blue Book [anythngbutgm]
Jan 10, 2010 (7:54 pm)
if you think you can just drop in the seat of a hipo car drive it anywhere near the limit, and feel as secure as a corolla on the interstate at the speed limit, you are bound to disappointed. the driver is the limitation, not the car.
#57 of 58 Re: if you score [Mr_Shiftright]
Jan 10, 2010 (10:11 pm)
Well, if you believe in JD Power even a little bit, Land Rover is a 1, and VW maybe a 2 (and Kia, and Suzuki....). Does that still make Porsche an 8 on the reliability scale?
A 93,000-mile Porsche seems like a fairly scary prospect (from my wallet's POV) for a purchase. Even if I can get it for only $9K.
I realized after making my earlier remarks that what I said can't really be applied to niche automakers like Porsche anyway. Desirability is 10 if you are single and looking for a sports car. For a family of four, it pretty much has a desirability quotient of 0.0 (sure, Dad might dream from time to time, but unless he's rich enough for an automotive bauble in the garage, it will never happen).
#58 of 58 Re: if you score [nippononly]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Jan 11, 2010 (9:10 am)
Well you hit the nail on the head...desirability really outscores reliability when it comes to resale---especially when it comes to say JD Powers, an impressive organization---but not impressive to a car enthusiast, who knows that JD Power are basically statisticians, not car people. They don't even drive cars, far as I know.
Yes I think Porsche reliability is extremely good. But they are what we called "narrowly engineered" cars and they do not suffer foolish owners who drive them like Corollas or who decline all the required maintenance. So by 90,000 miles, if the car has not been impeccably maintained by qualified personnel, you are going to have "deferred issues". Is that the same as poor reliability? I don't think so.
Sure, a Ferrari is 'fussy' and a 30,000 mile maintenance is going to cost you as much as a '98 Boxster, but that's the nature of the beast. You want excitement? You want maximum performance? You want prestige? You want tradition & heritage and membership in an exclusive club?
Well then, pony up on the MSRP and on the maintenance, and depreciation be damned!!