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Automotive News & Views What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?
1492 messages, Last post on Nov 04, 2009 at 7:37 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: ruking1 (Jan 05, 2009 12:59 pm) |
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Replying to: gregg_vw (Jan 05, 2009 1:27 pm) |
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Replying to: gregg_vw (Jan 05, 2009 1:27 pm)  75 mph, if I did not do it over two fill ups on a 965 miles leg of a return trip. I really have to stress that all I was trying to do was keep the highest possible speed to avoid a customer service stop by 3 state, 5 car highway patrol wolf packs, and turn off the radar detector; as it was very annoying. I was NOT trying to maximize fuel economy.   BUT I'll take both to the bank as it were, no tickets and good fuel mileage. As for the chip and/or injectors upgrades, they do/can have a Dr Jekyll/Mr Hyde characters to them. IF you upgrade, the key to continued good mileage is to resist the temptation to get on it, and just let it ride episodically. The other issue is both these upgrades have the capability of emphasizing (now) weak links, aka V6 clutch upgrade. 
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Jan 05, 2009 1:44 pm) |
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Jan 05, 2009 9:49 am) You need to IGNORE the cost per gallon... it is nearly irrelivant. I have a spreadsheet tracking every drop of fuel run thru my 2003 TDI. The overall fuel cost per mile is $0.05 Again, this is OVERALL cost from day1 of ownership over 100,000 miles.... not just a spike or best. (The best is $0.03) There is not another vehicle sold in North America that can come close to that. Your example of a suberu at $2/gallon is still over $0.10 per mile which is DOUBLE the cost of what my diesel gets. I get over 55MPG on a highway trip in 85 degree weather with 4 passengers and the AC blasting. (and trunk full of luggage) This is over 750 miles per tank of fuel. Are you going to tell me that opposing 4 gasoline engine in your suberu can do that? Also, a diesel engine is designed to run over 300,000 miles. A suberu will have troubles getting 1/2 of that. Additionaly, a gasoline engine has more maintainace costs than diesel. For example, a diesel has no sparkplugs nor ignition system to mess with. Finally, a diesel engine recoups most of the initial cost at resale time. asically, most of your arguments are based on misunderstanding of the true costs involved. The good news is that suberu makes a diesel automobile. I would like to have a 4-wheel-drive diesel car for Vermont winters
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Replying to: bpeebles (Jan 05, 2009 5:02 pm) My spreadsheet includes purchase price, taxes, insurance, depreciation, etc. My minivan is running about .40 cents a mile to own and operate over a decade. Or you can use the True Cost to Own tool for average comparisons for cars made since '03. |
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Replying to: bpeebles (Jan 05, 2009 5:02 pm) True if you are a salesman or something this may matter, but for the average American driver, that .02 cents a mile advantage you have over 12,500 miles a year isn't anything to write home about. As for "designed to go 300,000 miles"....please, no disrespect intended, but that is simply not substantiated by any sound evidence. It is, as we say, an urban legend. And even if it WERE true--by god, let's say IT IS TRUE, a bare slim fractional number of American drivers take a car to that mileage. Why don't they? Various reasons, but one being that the rest of the car is not built to go 300,000 without falling to pieces or looking mighty shabby. I mean, I'm right with you about grounding the discussion back into the "real world", and yes, a Subaru will never achieve .05 cents a mile. The point is, does that even matter for most of us?
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Jan 05, 2009 6:38 pm) Here is my real world complaints about all the 4 banger gas cars I have seen and ridden in. They cannot keep up on the SoCA Interstate highways without down shifting and screaming up to over 4000 RPM. They are few and far between that can get 500 mile range on a tank of gas. Most of the V6 & V8 gas engines are not much better. If you compare the BMW X5 35d to the X5 V8 you will see that the diesel is more than 1/2 second faster 0-60 mph, and has 75 more ft lbs of torque at half the RPMs. The diesel will go at least 33% further on a gallon of fuel. And the TMV is $6000 less on the diesel X5. So what would be the downside to buying a BMW diesel? I got to get out and test drive them while the price of diesel is high.
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at $1.66/gallon, my Echo costs me $0.04/mile for gas. That's based on the 41.5 mpg lifetime average it has produced. And while I am only at 112K miles, it has yet to require a single repair. Some Echo owners have reported they are still chugging at mileages well in excess of 200K miles with no repairs to the engine. I would expect it to go 300K miles without major engine repairs, based on many gas Toyotas I have owned. If you include "purchase price, taxes, insurance, depreciation, etc.", I'm doing even better, as the Echo cost half the price of a Jetta diesel to buy new and is dirt cheap to insure. All of which is to say there's more than one way to skin a cat (ummm, is that how that old expression goes??!!). Now if they could get the Cooper Clubman a diesel that was as fun to drive as the gas model, made 60 mpg, and sold for $22K, I would probably jump on it. But what if the Fit were just as much fun to drive for $6K less, and the only difference was the fuel economy? Well, then the Fit would be my choice. I guess the bottom line is I am waiting for some truly frugal, inexpensive diesel choices to enter the market, while still driving better than a Prius. That and gas at $3+ per gallon again would pull diesel buyers into the market. Maybe. |
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Ford builds the Interceptor sedan concept from a couple years ago (but please make the glass taller - I'm sick and tired of these gunslit windows)  This would most likely use the EcoBoost V6 if produced, but if they add... - a 3.0-3.5 liter 60° V6 diesel, 225-250 hp, 375-400 lb-ft - an automated manual trans - AWD ...I might be talked out of trucks. Otherwise, I'll stick with my Cummins-powered Dodge Ram. kcram - Pickups/Wagons Host |
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