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What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

9710 messages,  Last post on Jun 18, 2013 at 7:18 PM

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What is this discussion about? Car Buying, Biodiesel, Diesel, Hybrid Cars, Coupe, Hatchback, SUV

Messages Page 591 of 971

#5900 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [steve_] by byrn

Jun 10, 2012 (8:51 am)

Replying to: Stever@Edmunds (Jun 08, 2012 9:22 am)
A lot of spin here (no offense intended) about how clean diesels are. Apparently the newer ones are so clean you can suck down the emissions and be better for it. YetI thought the oil derived content in their emissions was higher?
 
Anyway, seems now matter how new a Ford with it's huge tail pipe is it always reeks. Like I tell my kid,
 
You can always smell a Ford.

#5901 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [steve_] by byrn

Jun 10, 2012 (9:08 am)

Replying to: Stever@Edmunds (Jun 08, 2012 10:33 am)
Not saying anyone here so don't jump down my throat, but there seems to be this strange subset of drivers out there which apparently view it as a macho thing to leave their diesel running, fouling up the air for fifty ft around while casually standing nearby as if diesel fumes were the most natural thing in the world to breathe.
 
I don't mind people doing that to themselves if that's what they choose, but I have a kid in elementary school and it really irks me when people driving these huge trucks pull up alongside the curb in front of the school refusing to turn them off while waiting to pick up their kid, all the while callously belching horrible fumes that dozens of children have to walk through. Seems kind of rude to me.

#5902 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [byrn] by Stever@Edmunds HOST

Jun 10, 2012 (10:16 am)

Replying to: byrn (Jun 10, 2012 9:08 am)
The neighbor's nephew did that last summer - showed up at 6 am and went in to chat. Left his diesel truck clattering for a good 15 minutes.
 
Idling in any rig irritates me though. Love to have a remote control gizmo that would shut down the engine in those situations (and one for cell phones and TVs, Harleys...). Idling is illegal in many places but rarely enforced. Maybe you need to donate one of these to your school.
 
This is an interesting one too.

#5903 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [byrn] by ruking1

Jun 10, 2012 (11:36 am)

Replying to: byrn (Jun 10, 2012 8:51 am)
The real spin is in spite of the facts, most still think diesels are cleaner than gassers. !! For some reason, you acknowledge Ford (gassers) being "dirtier", but haven't made the logical transition in the case of cleaner diesel fuel and way less diesel emissions. As you indicate, no offense intended. I will go back to not confusing people with the facts, as it is more than apparent 95% of the folks vote with their pocket books for dirtier fuel (RUG/PUG). I actually still own gassers. Martyrdom is the FARTHEST thing from my mind and universe.
 
So for example, even if I got 15 mpg with my 16/18 year old gassers with diesel, the torque would be utterly wild. We pretty much had/ continue to drive them fairly conservatively to get 15 to 17 mpg (gassers) (125,000 and 225,000 miles respectively) . FF to 2012 with the same weight (but TDI) machine, the torque on the TDI is absolutely (still) staggering (fun is my translation), much more capable and road worthy and the mpg is more like 31 to 36 mpg and way less of a need to drive "conservatively" to get 31 to 36 mpg aka to 107% to 112% better fuel mileage.
 
Again it is demonstrated time and time again that really nobody cares that any one gets 15 mpg, nor does anyone care that the same weighted vehicle can now get 31 to 36 mpg. However I do and was willing to make the RUG/PUG switch. If anyone is not, pretty simple, DON'T switch.
 
The fact that there is a market for upcoming 44 mpg crossover suvs (albeit lighter) is very exciting for potential and diesels' consumers.

#5904 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [steve_] by byrn

Jun 10, 2012 (12:35 pm)

Replying to: Stever@Edmunds (Jun 10, 2012 10:16 am)
Why do diesel owners do this? I once heard someone say something about diesels being hard to start or other but I don't know.
 
I have an unemployed relative who, I hear, likes to go out every morning and start up his chain saw then just leave it idling even though he has no actual chainsaw work to do. Makes him, and the neighbors I assume, feel like he's doing something productive.
 
In the case of diesel owners I suspect it has something to do with the sound of power they have. A way to impress others, and we all know how American consumers have been flooded with the message that your car has to look and sound POWERFUL, something Europeans have not fallen for. Seems like a waste of gas to me though. All that supposed gas mileage betterment going up in idling. Plus it's annoying to live next door to one. Can't go outside without being overwhelmed by fumes, and forget peace and quiet.
 
We own a "gasser", a 97 Nissan 200 SX. It has around 325,000 miles on it and still runs good. Smooth and quiet. Not only that but it gets 37 miles to the gallon.

#5905 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [byrn] by ruking1

Jun 10, 2012 (2:01 pm)

Replying to: byrn (Jun 10, 2012 12:35 pm)
..."We own a "gasser", a 97 Nissan 200 SX. It has around 325,000 miles on it and still runs good. Smooth and quiet. Not only that but it gets 37 miles to the gallon."...
 
Several questions. So what is wrong with that? (we have a 04 Civic 140,000 miles and hope it goes 4 tune ups or 480,000 miles. It currently gets 38-42 mpg in a 54 miles daily R/T commute)
 
But at the same time while 37 mpg is good, what would be wrong with a diesel (using the same ratios as VW 2003 1.9 TDI( 46.5 mpg) to VW 2003 gasser 2.0 (29.9 mpg) ) 58 mpg? So in your case is using 8,784 gals vs 5,603 gals (+/-3181 gals more/less) better or worst? You of course stated what you have chosen .

#5906 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [byrn] by gagrice

Jun 10, 2012 (6:41 pm)

Replying to: byrn (Jun 10, 2012 12:35 pm)
It kind of depends on where you live. I worked 25 years in the Arctic and we left our gas and diesel trucks running 12 hours a day during the 7+ months of winter. When we had a service call we did not have the luxury of warming a truck for 30 minutes or more. It would have been nice to have a heated garage to keep them in. Places like Fairbanks AK in the winter about half the cars in the shopping malls will be idling while folks shop. It causes a lot of ice fog with not great air to breath.
 
That said I do not believe you will find a new diesel car sold in the USA today that is as dirty emissions wise as you 1987 Nissan. Your gripe seems to be with people driving big honkin diesel PU Trucks. Which is completely the fault of the US government. They have blocked all smaller diesel PU trucks from being sold since the 1980s. And you can blame your local government for making it unsafe to let your kids walk or ride their bikes to school. Parents do not want their children molested by all the perverts the courts turn loose in our towns. And they charge around here a fortune for a kid to ride the bus. And if it is a cold climate, a diesel will not use as much fuel idling as a gasser. You could go to the Army/Navy and buy a gas mask.

#5907 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [byrn] by larsb

Jun 11, 2012 (6:41 am)

Replying to: byrn (Jun 10, 2012 12:35 pm)
byrn says, "We own a "gasser", a 97 Nissan 200 SX. It has around 325,000 miles on it and still runs good. Smooth and quiet. Not only that but it gets 37 miles to the gallon. "
 
Wow. I owned a 1980 200SX and got 323,000 miles before trading it in for $300.
 
I didn't know they were STILL made that well though !!!
 
Impressive, Nissan, impressive.

#5908 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [larsb] by Stever@Edmunds HOST

Jun 11, 2012 (7:48 am)

Replying to: larsb (Jun 11, 2012 6:41 am)
My '99 Nissan only has 176,000 miles. Gets no respect.
 
Motortrend compares 40 mpg cars and the Jetta TDI falls in the middle in their estimation.
 
"Diesel fuel inherently packs about 10 percent more energy into each of its gallons, so you need to lower the TDI's mpg by 10 percent for a fair mpg comparison with its gas alternatives. On the other hand, diesel #2 is now costing about 8 percent more than regular grade gasoline (i.e., you're still slightly ahead of the game). But if we compute the Jetta's fuel cost per mile, the Volkswagen's actually beaten (though only slightly) by the Civic and Cruze. Worse, the TDI's base price is over $2000 dearer than those two. If these high-tech gasoline-powered cars are a headache for cost-penalized hybrids, the same goes for diesels."
 
Not sure why they needed to lower the TDI's mpg by 10 percent for the comparison though.
 
40 MPG Compact Sedan Comparison

#5909 of 9710 Re: More down to earth... [steve_] by gagrice

Jun 11, 2012 (9:30 am)

Replying to: Stever@Edmunds (Jun 11, 2012 7:48 am)
Motor Trend may be off on their energy percentage. And when you add ethanol the energy is even lower.
 
a gallon of diesel fuel contains 147,000 British Thermal Units (BTU) of energy. Gasoline contains about 125,000 BTU of energy per gallon.

 
That whole MT comparison was confusing and illogical. I guess you have to consider the source. Look what they have picked as cars of the year.

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