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What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

1503 messages,  Last post on Nov 14, 2009 at 1:11 PM

You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires

What is this discussion about? Car Buying, Biodiesel, Diesel, Hybrid Cars, Coupe, Hatchback, SUV


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#1279 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [bpeebles] by ruking1
Jun 23, 2009 (7:12 pm)
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Replying to: bpeebles (Jun 23, 2009 6:32 pm)

There are other less "sexy things". Honda has a 20,000 miles oil filter change recommendation. I thought that was pretty amazing when I first reviewed my 04 Civic specifications. The problem is most folks do not believe it, let alone follow it.
 
VW has oil filters specified for 30,000 miles.
 
Right now over 87,000 miles, all the wear able parts on the Civic are wearing app 2x faster than the Jetta's wear able parts. Another example, I need three alignments where the Jetta needed none.
#1280 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [ruking1] by steve_ HOST
Jun 23, 2009 (8:00 pm)
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Replying to: ruking1 (Jun 23, 2009 7:12 pm)

And how can you not love a car that has a Pumpe Düse engine? Although I hear VW switched to a CRDi in the US.
 
(the stuff you see around Edmunds every day... a real learning experience)
#1281 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [ruking1] by jkinzel
Jun 23, 2009 (8:10 pm)
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Replying to: ruking1 (Jun 23, 2009 7:12 pm)

I know, off topic.
 
Speaking of oil changes, I got the second hand account on this one. I’ll not name names to protect me and the company, BUT. A tug was brought to Puget Sound from another port and the local shipyard started doing some maintenance for use here.
 
Long story short; The boat is 3,000HP with two EMD’s. All the maintenance over the past five years had been performed on time including fuel and OIL filters. What engine room logs showed and was later reveled is that the main engine oil had not been changed since 2004. Yes, 5 years without an oil change.
 
The boat runs great, in fact I spent 7 days on it this month and it never missed a beat.
#1282 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [jkinzel] by ruking1
Jun 23, 2009 (9:08 pm)
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Replying to: jkinzel (Jun 23, 2009 8:10 pm)

Just for comparisons sake, you might want to list the sump size and bypass filtration etc.
#1283 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [steve_] by ruking1
Jun 23, 2009 (9:12 pm)
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Replying to: steve_ (Jun 23, 2009 8:00 pm)

Well indeed there has been a lot of mis steps with the PD engine. VW certainly did not do themselves any favors with that engine that hit the US markets.
 
The 2009 TDI is a CRD.
#1284 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [ruking1] by jkinzel
Jun 23, 2009 (10:00 pm)
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Replying to: ruking1 (Jun 23, 2009 9:08 pm)

I don't have that information, but I would guess the base to be about 20ft x 5ft. I have no idea how many gallons in each engine.
#1285 of 1503
Re: well this [gagrice] by nippononly
Jun 24, 2009 (12:29 am)
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Replying to: gagrice (Jun 23, 2009 7:56 am)

VW is building a new plant here to meet the need.
 
VW is building a plant here to sell gas-powered Passats, to whit a new Passat NOT shared with the European market, and "dumbed down" for American tastes and to reach a cheaper price point. Has nothing to do with TDI production.
 
1/3 or 1/2 or 60% of not much is still not much. I guess in order to gauge how well diesels could REALLY sell here, we need one of the Big 6 (of which VW isn't one) to introduce a diesel on one of their volume models.
 
I got a survey after I bought my last Subaru asking me if I would be willing to pay $3000 extra for a diesel in a future Sube. I said yes, I would, but I also said I would be willing to spend $2500 more for a hybrid version, and lastly when asked to comment I said I would not buy another new Subaru unless it got at least 20% better fuel economy than the one I just bought (averaging 30 mpg so far, AWD and all). Diesel will probably be the easiest way for them to go, but either diesel or hybrid will save me my 20% in fuel.
#1286 of 1503
Re: well this [nippononly] by gagrice
Jun 24, 2009 (5:30 am)
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Replying to: nippononly (Jun 24, 2009 12:29 am)

I am sure the new factory will be flexible in that it can build most any vehicle VW chooses. They may change their plans if they cannot get enough Jetta TDI volume from Mexico. The only VW that would make me jump for joy is the Tiguan TDI with the same diesel engine as the new Golf GTD. It is the only mini CUV I found to be comfortable for me. And it gets 43 MPG US out on the highway. What's not to like? That is the 4Motion version.
 
If VW does not bring the Golf or Tiguan TDI, I may use the clunker plan and get a Touareg TDI for my diesel rig. I am not thrilled with the urea crap, but life is far from perfect. The restrictions on buying an SUV under the plan are pretty lenient.
 
The new SUV or pickup truck: Must cost $45,000 or less (MSR), must obtain 2 mpg better than the old for $3500, and 5 mpg for $4500.
#1287 of 1503
Re: Does that even matter? [bpeebles] by bumpy
Jun 24, 2009 (7:54 am)
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Replying to: bpeebles (Jun 23, 2009 6:32 pm)

The VW TDI is a proven design that works.
 
Sadly, though, that engine was installed in cars that have the reliability of the average Daewoo or older Kia. Some folks are okay with that; I'm not one of them.
#1288 of 1503
it's hot, I can't sleep by nippononly
Jun 28, 2009 (10:31 pm)
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so I thought I would post this tidbit from Automotive News today:
 
Automakers scrap diesel plans
 
Mainstream carmakers have put the brakes on nine diesel-powered vehicles that had been scheduled for 2010.
 
Honda, Chrysler, Ford, General Motors, Nissan and Toyota have halted diesel programs because of spiraling costs and other problems.
 
Financial problems halted the programs at some companies. Others, like Toyota Motor Corp., are looking elsewhere for fuel economy. "We are banking heavily on hybrids," said Toyota spokesman Curt McAllister.
 
.....A diesel engine typically delivers fuel economy 20 to 30 percent better than that of a gasoline engine. But a diesel can add between $3,000 and $8,000 to a vehicle's price. Costly components include the turbocharger, the high-pressure fuel injection system and the complex emissions system, which is filled with precious metals. That cost seems to be a barrier for the mass-market brands.
 
......The image of the diesel engine may be one reason Toyota has halted its plans. Says McAllister: "One of the obstacles of the diesel is the aged perception that the diesel is smoky and stinky. It's hard to change the mind-set of consumers. Hybrid technology has such a clean halo to it."
 
And just to mollify gagrice a bit (!!):
 
Kevin McMahon, a partner at the Martec Group, a consulting firm, says the way the EPA calculates fuel economy and carbon dioxide standards gives gasoline-electric hybrids an unfair advantage over diesels.
 
http://www.autonews.com/article/20090629/ANA06/306299972/1178
(registration link)
 
One thing is for sure, if only the Europeans are taking on diesels for the foreseeable future, they will remain a tiny percentage of overall automotobile sales in the U.S.

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