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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [kernick]
by nippononly
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Oct 12, 2009 (11:45 am)
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Replying to: kernick (Oct 12, 2009 9:23 am)
So wait, you're talking about a 5-10 year scenario that depends on sizable investment by individual utilities???
Oh, well then, lower gasoline prices are just around the corner!
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- #2145 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [kernick]
by andre1969
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Oct 12, 2009 (12:10 pm)
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Replying to: kernick (Oct 12, 2009 9:23 am)
I did something kinda knee-jerk back in 2008...switching from oil heat to an electric heat pump. I had been wanting to do it for awhile, but when oil prices went to around $5.62 per gallon over the summer of '08, that clinched it for me. Of course, by the time I committed to the heat pump, prices dropped like a rock. I think my grandmother renewed her contract in September of '08, something like market price with a $3.07/gal cap.
I averaged about 450 gallons of oil per year, so at $5.62 per gallon, I was looking at around $2500 per year just to heat the place! I knew the heat pump would make my electric bill go up, but I figured there's no way it would make it shoot up $2500 per year. However, with oil down to around $3.00 per gallon, well that's around $1350 per year. At that point, the savings is a bit more iffy.
This past winter, I did have one electric bill that ran around $514 (our electric rates shot up...leave it to me to switch energy sources just as one drops and the other rises. ) However, this has also been the coldest winter we've had in about 5 years, so if I was still on oil, I probably would've used more than my 450 gal/yr average.
I probably made the best choice in the long run, but I was mentally kicking myself for awhile. Anyway, if nothing else, I freed up an average of 450 gallons of oil per year that can now be allocated elsewhere.
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- #2146 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [nippononly]
by kernick
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Oct 12, 2009 (5:23 pm)
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Replying to: nippononly (Oct 12, 2009 11:45 am)
The fossil-fuel energy pie is something that is long term. Oil, natural gas, and coal are all fossil fuels that can often be interchanged for the same uses. So when more natural gas or coal are discovered and used, this means that there will be less oil used, then otherwise would be used.
For example if natural gas production were to decrease each of the next 5-10 years what would people do for heat? Some would turn to coal, but for the cleanliness and ease factor many would convert and burn heating oil. In many ways energy is just one big pie-chart.
And if we put a lot of windfarms in and produce relatively cheap electricity, then yes that does free-up oil for other uses such as diesel vehicles. Because energy demand keeps going up with population growth we need to use all forms of energy.
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- #2147 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [nippononly]
by gagrice
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Oct 12, 2009 (5:54 pm)
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Replying to: nippononly (Oct 12, 2009 6:47 am)
I think it has been explained pretty well. One other thing the added source of NG will do. Gas to Liquid is just coming on line in places like Qatar. Exxon and others are producing a super high grade of diesel fuel from NG with NO sulfur. That can be shipped very economically to the market. Best get you a diesel car to take advantage of it.
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- #2148 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [larsb]
by gagrice
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Oct 12, 2009 (6:12 pm)
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Replying to: larsb (Oct 12, 2009 6:59 am)
The Fit and Yaris are econoboxes with slight improvements from the Yugo. I will keep my Sequoia till someone offers a vehicle that does all I want and gets better mileage. I am sitting in Globe AZ with 5300 miles on this trip so far. Averaging 18+ MPG with no improvement going slower. At this point it will take an improvement of 10 MPG with an equal sized vehicle to get me to switch.
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- #2149 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [gagrice]
by steve_ HOST
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Oct 12, 2009 (6:18 pm)
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Replying to: gagrice (Oct 12, 2009 5:54 pm)
Or a CNG one. Seems to be quite a few public CNG stations down in Utah on the interstate corridor, mostly for semis.
Apparently someone down in Reno has figured out how to generate power from geothermal wells that doesn't require the superheated water that the current ones have. Right now you need 225°F to 360°F water for a "binary" plant (one's in Mammoth CA and there's one at Raft River here in Idaho), or over 360°F for a "flash steam" plant.
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- #2150 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [gagrice]
by larsb
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Oct 13, 2009 (6:53 am)
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Replying to: gagrice (Oct 12, 2009 6:12 pm)
They only fit PART of the econobox definition - high gas mileage.
They are not stripped down with zero luxury options - you can outfit them to the max.
Every carmaker needs a "bottom feeder" vehicle. The Fit and Yaris are that car, but they are nowhere NEAR the stripped-down versions of econoboxes you could buy in the 80s and 90s.
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- #2151 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [larsb]
by gagrice
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Oct 13, 2009 (4:26 pm)
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Replying to: larsb (Oct 13, 2009 6:53 am)
The econoboxes of today may have more gadgets and safety. They do not have the fuel economy of the old Honda Civics or Rabbit diesels. The old 85 Honda Civic was rated 35% better than the new Honda Fit. I bet the new one is not as much fun to drive as the old CRX. So tell me again where we are doing better? Add to that the Fit is butt ugly. Makes the Aztek look presentable.
So if you think 29 MPG on a Fit is real great I don't know what to tell you.
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- #2152 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [gagrice]
by fezo
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Oct 13, 2009 (5:45 pm)
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Replying to: gagrice (Oct 13, 2009 4:26 pm)
That is something that the horsepower wars and other factors did to modern cars.
My old 85 Sentra would do 40 mpg on the highway without breaking a sweat. Try that with a current Sentra.
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- #2153 of 2183
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Re: Looks like gas may go under $2 again [fezo]
by dieselone
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Oct 14, 2009 (2:59 am)
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Replying to: fezo (Oct 13, 2009 5:45 pm)
They've gotten a lot bigger and heavier. Not to many cars under 3,000lbs and 100hp anymore.
Granted, I don't want to every drive an '86 Escort or anything from '86 again.
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