Sunroof leak on my Saturn Outlook

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490 messages, Last post on Jun 11, 2013 at 8:44 PM

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What is this discussion about? Saturn Outlook, SUV

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#481 of 490 Junk! by mklvkc

May 10, 2013 (9:06 pm)

Abandon ship! These vehicles are JUNK. Get an attorney (through Lemonaid.com if you are in WI) or try to return the vehicle under return clauses in your contract. If financed through a bank or non-dealership source they may be willing to help in order to protect their interests. Good luck.

#482 of 490 Re: 07 Outlook, leak, headlight, AC...multiple problems [gmcustsvc] by smoore812

May 11, 2013 (8:20 am)

Replying to: gmcustsvc (Feb 19, 2013 8:54 am)

I purchased my 08 Saturn outlook exactly 7 days ago.. I have already had to take it to have the fuse box replaced do to corrosion from leaky sun/moon roof. Now I am being told there is nothing that can be done. I have only had this car for 7 days, I love it! but I am financed in for 5 years, haven't even paid my first payment yet, and I already am faced with a vehicle that I cant drive. I don't want anything accept for the sun/moon roof fixed replace the seals/tubes whatever it is that is causing the issues, please! all im asking is you stand behind your product and fix its issue. Please help me!

Replies to this message:

gmcustsvc (May 11, 2013 1:15 pm)
anglins4 (May 13, 2013 2:15 pm)
- domp (May 13, 2013 5:10 pm)

#483 of 490 Re: So far... [smoore812] by nancy1960

May 11, 2013 (8:50 am)

Replying to: smoore812 (May 10, 2013 6:05 pm)

I was in your same position. A month after purchasing our Outlook massive problems started to occur.... We too had a loan. Too make a long story short, we had to return the car to the bank despite all the extensive repairs. We could not continue to pay on a car that continue to have serious electrical problems and unsafe to drive. Our fuse box was flooded along with the motor to the back hatch. I was devastated to say the least... When I returned the car to the bank, I gave the bank all the documented repairs and history on the well known problems the Saturns have had. The car was in the shop a total of 40 days combined. I could not in good conscious trade this car in and pass along this nightmare. I would like to note that GM paid for all the repairs and rented us a car. There was a service bulletin to extend the sunroof drains and despite repairs, as you can see, that repaired failed many of us! There is a little secret that GM has and it's called a Secret Warranty!! This is why they pay for repairs to prevent a class action.
There are some States like CA that not only have a Lemon Law (that does not apply to so many of us) but breach of warranty of mercantability. This only applies to certain States. It allows a vehicle owner a repurchase if the vehicle has so many problems that it does not meet the legal standard for ordinary goods of this type. Check your State and see if this applies to you.
I don't think the dealers can take all the blame. The blame lies with GM as this is a manufacturer defect. It's criminal and has hurt their customers financially, emotionally and with a flooded fuse box your car can just die, thankfully, mine died in my driveway! If I/we were on the freeway it could have been fatal.

I feel so bad for you as I know how blown away you are. Research these pages and be prepared when you talk with GM.

Here is information on the Secret Warranty. As you go down this unfortunate path you will see how this information applies to us all!!

Secret warranties are a multi-billion consumer abuse. Every auto company makes mistakes in building cars. Whether they are design defects that affect every car or whether they are manufacturing defects which affect only some cars, they must be repaired. The only question is who pays for the manufacturers' mistakes, the manufacturer or the consumer. Although the auto manufacturer often establishes a secret warranty to pay for the repair, all too often it is the consumer who pays for the manufacturer's mistake because the consumer never finds out about the secret warranty. That's wrong and the Center for Auto Safety wants to change it.

In a 1987 report the Center for Auto Safety (CAS) created national headlines by identifying 10 exemplary secret warranties covering 30 million vehicles and $3 billion in repair costs. Yet this is but the tip of the iceberg for we estimate that at any one time over 500 secret warranties exist for all auto companies. According to a Toyota whistleblower who provided a complete list in May 1988, Toyota alone had 41 secret warranties at that time.

By exposing secret warranties, CAS forces manufacturers to pay for their mistakes and creates a strong incentive for them to build better cars in the future. once secret warranties are disclosed, consumers will save hundreds, if not thousands, in repair bills on their personal cars. Spurred on by CAS exposes, state legislatures are moving to pass secret warranty disclosure laws that will protect consumers. Until then, consumers must rely on the strategies suggested in our book, Little Secrets of the Auto Industry, to discover and use secret warranties to pay for repairs in their vehicles.

What is a secret warranty?
Auto companies hate the term secret warranties. They call them policy adjustments, good will programs, service campaigns or extended warranties . But whatever they are called, they are a longstanding industry practice. When a car company has a major defect that occurs after its written warranty expires, it establishes an adjustment policy to pay for repairs rather than deal with many thousands, if not millions, of complaints on a case by case basis. But the auto company communicates the policy only to regional offices and not even always to its dealers. The auto manufacturers never notify the consumer; so only the consumer who complains loudly enough gets covered by the secret warranty. Other consumers end up bearing the costs of the manufacturer's mistakes.

Examples of Secret Warranties
CAS has documented case after case of secret warranties since our founding in 1970. one of the first and most famous was Ford's J-67 Limited Service Program which covered rust on 12 million 1969-72 cars and trucks. In this case a bulletin which went out only to Ford regional offices stated, "This is a limited service program without dealership notification and should be administered on an individual complaint basis." Under this program, Ford would pay up to 100% to repair rust and paint damage on its vehicles even if it cost over a $1000.

CAS has uncovered secret warranties on all auto companies with little differences between them. A 1972 Mazda secret warranty bulletin doubled the coverage for rotary engine damage but cautioned, "Since this is a temporary program which may be terminated at [any] time, owners are not to be informed of the extended coverage." Honda had secret warranties on head gaskets and rusting fenders in the mid-1970's; Chrysler had rusting fenders on Volares and Aspens in the late 1970's; GM had the transmission secret warranty caused by a ban on sperm whale oil as a lubricant; Peugeot and Subaru both covered defective head gaskets; and VW covered valve stem seals.

Secret warranties soared after 1980 when the federal government dropped all efforts to ban them. GM had a 5 year/50,000 mile secret warranty covering repair of defective rack and pinion power steering systems on all 16 million of its 1981-88 front wheel drive cars. Toyota covered pulsating brakes on its 1983-86 Camry in a $100 million secret warranty. Ford never told owners of its 1985-92 F-series pickups that America's most popular truck had peeling paint because Ford skipped the primer layer. According to Nissan documents provided to CAS by a whistleblower in 1990, Nissan had at one time up to 48 secret warranties covering various cars and trucks.

There is no doubt that auto manufacturers presently have many other secret warranties. However, assessing how widespread secret warranty programs are is difficult because these programs, by definition, are not intended for public disclosure. Since CAS began exposing secret warranties more widely in the 1980's, the auto makers having gotten better at keeping them secret. Even CAS can no longer get lists of secret warranties to disclose. one Honda insider told CAS that Honda has only one secret warranty book for each of its regions. The book is chained to a desk.

#484 of 490 Re: 07 Outlook, leak, headlight, AC...multiple problems [smoore812] by gmcustsvc

May 11, 2013 (1:15 pm)

Replying to: smoore812 (May 11, 2013 8:20 am)

smoore812,

I can certainly look into your concern with your sunroof. Can you please email me your information at socialmedia

gm.com ATTN: Erica? I will need you to provide me with your name, VIN, mileage, address, phone number, and the name of the Certified GM Dealership you are working with in regards to this concern. Look forward to hearing from you soon.

Erica Tiffany
GM Customer Service

#485 of 490 Re: 07 Outlook, leak, headlight, AC...multiple problems [smoore812] by anglins4

May 13, 2013 (2:15 pm)

Replying to: smoore812 (May 11, 2013 8:20 am)

PLEASE.... file a complaint with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) at https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/ Everyone having these problems needs to file a complaint to help keep this from happening to others. We are still fighting with GM to help with our repairs. Now we can't even get a rep from GM to call us back. It has been a nightmare for so many. We also went thru "Sara" here on this forum and got NOWHERE... We were offered $3000 on a new GM vehicle....who can afford a new car when we can't in good conscience trade in our Outlook! Our latest is we found a service bulletin on one of our problems and the dealer tells us because our VIN number is not included they can't do anything for us! It's all so unbelievable! We all need to file a complaint! Good Luck to you!!

Replies to this message:

domp (May 13, 2013 5:10 pm)

#486 of 490 Re: 07 Outlook, leak, headlight, AC...multiple problems [anglins4] by domp

May 13, 2013 (5:10 pm)

Replying to: anglins4 (May 13, 2013 2:15 pm)

Agree 100%. I've just hit 100k miles and now the transmission is acting odd. I can't afford repairing a wave plate transmission issue right now. I've just finished paying for all the repairs caused by the sunroof leak. Wondering what it's going to take for gm to own up to these issues.

#487 of 490 Re: Leaky Roof = Many Problems? [dassarina] by anglins4

May 13, 2013 (5:35 pm)

Replying to: dassarina (May 05, 2013 4:26 am)

Replies to this message:

tallgolf (Jun 11, 2013 8:44 pm)

#488 of 490 Re: sunroof leak on my 2007 saturn [lakegal] by ghman59

Jun 11, 2013 (2:43 pm)

Replying to: lakegal (Jun 16, 2008 3:16 pm)

Sunroof leaking 2008 outlook xr: there is an easy fix to this problem if you are mechanically inclined. There is a drain tube that runs from the sunroof corners if sitting in your car looking out the front on the left and right side. If you open the roof and climb up the running board look into the front most right and left hand corners of the plastic cutter and you will see a hole the size of a Q tip head or 3/16 th size drill bit thickness. Take an air hose from a compressor with an air nozzel (not a tire nozzel) the type you would blow the dirt off a floor with. Put this agianst the hole and pull the trigger you will see either dirt or water come shooting out of the wheel well on what ever side you are doing. There is a rubber grommit that is at the end of the water drain that gets clogged by very small debri and pollen which is set into the firewall and once that is slightly wet it drys and hardens because of the design in the grommit. It has a very small slit in it like an X to not let I guess bugs crawl in it and this is where the dirt rests and drys which then cloggs the hole. Trust me I had to totally take mine out by dropping the front of the head liner and take off the plastic along the colunnm and part of the dash board to pull mine out. I threaded a wire through mine which was explained in a way to clean it out and the wire got stuck. This is in my opinion that there is a flaw design in the grommit not allowing enough water to flow through without getting clogged. So the best way without going through what I have is to use an air hose occasionally and just blow the dirt out even though this shouldnt be after paying all this money for an SUV.

So the drain hose runs from the sun roof corner down the windshield post to slightlly under the dashboard to a grommit in the firewall.

#490 of 490 Re: Leaky Roof = Many Problems? [anglins4] by tallgolf

Jun 11, 2013 (8:44 pm)

Replying to: anglins4 (May 13, 2013 5:35 pm)

I am so sorry the sunroof/moonroof complaints continue to grow. This is such a hideous problem. I hate to read about the safety issues people have. We did contact the NHTSA - no response. These people from GM who come on here, all they do is tell you to get your car fixed. No offer of any help with paying for it, despite the design flaw in the car. If we could afford endless repair bills, I think we would all take the cars in, right? My husband believes its just to get you to stop posting here. My advice is to try and get to your regional GM rep. They have the connections to help you. And, may even feel sympathy for you. Ours did. Gratefully.

We are happy with our Dodge Crew now. Liked the Outlook more, but that chapter is closed. GOOD LUCK everyone.. keep pushing. Remember - YOU are right!

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