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Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Volkswagen Tiguan Lease Questions
142 messages, Last post on Nov 10, 2009 at 8:57 AM
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Replying to: jseinfeld (Apr 23, 2009 5:58 am) Post your MSRP, sale price plus fees, residual and money factor and we can more accurately gauge your deal. I was merely saying $400 a month with $1200 down ain't too great.
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Replying to: stoopy (Apr 23, 2009 8:22 am) As I was saying earlier, however, it doesn't matter to me what the money factor or APR is. All I know is this: the car is worth a certain amount; in my case, let's say it's $29,000. After "renting" it from the bank it depreciates by a percentage of its original value; for the Tiguan, let's conservatively say it's 50%, i.e., the car is worth half of original value after I'm through with it, which is $14,500. This means that for the bank to break even, i.e., get back the $29,000 it gives to VW for the car, it has to charge me $14,500 and then hope it gets the same at auction at lease end. This means that my base monthly price should be $14,500 / 36 months = 402.78, not counting tax. Tax in my state is 7%. Thus, over the life of the lease, I have to pay about 50% of that, which is $1015, and over 36 months is $28.20. So my total, if the bank had its druthers, would be $430.98 (and they'd hope to sell the car for more than $14.5k). I'm paying $394, including tax. How's that not a good deal? Reverse the numbers. I'm paying about $365.80 as my base price. At that rate, after 36 months, the bank is getting $13,168.80, which means it only depreciated 45%, which is realistic, but also optimistic. Even if I could have negotiated longer and gotten the price down to $27,000, my deal is still good, as my monthly payments end up being 48%, which is within the ballpark for depreciation amounts. So, if you think I'm wrong, please educate me where the mistake is. I'm not being facetious here, I'd really like to know. Also, the $1200 isn't money I put down. I put $0 down, as putting anything down is silly in my opinion. The $1200 includes first month's payment ($394) (which actually I'm getting back due to graduating in the past 24 months), acquisition fee ($575), DMV fees ($187), tire fees ($7), etc.
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Replying to: jseinfeld (Apr 23, 2009 9:04 am) Second, in a lot of areas, including mine, you can get 0% financing for up to 60 months. Assuming you qualified and used your $1200 due at signing to lessen your sales tax burden you could've bought this for $27,000. Payment would've been $380 on a 60 month loan. Why lease when buying is cheaper? That's the point of leasing (to lessen your payment since you are just RENTING part of the value of the vehicle). In my opinion, if you can't save at least $100 a month leasing, BUY IT. Back on the leasing subject. You paid your acquisition fee up front. This is money down whether you think so or not. It isn't Cap Cost Reduction but it is money that is normally included in a lease. Personally I don't see how your lease payment is even as low as you claim. The residual is 53% right? So MSRP is $29,625, residual is $15,701.25. You said in a previous post "Even if I could have negotiated longer and gotten the price down to $27,000.." What was your Net Cap then? At $28,000 it would mean a base payment of $341.63 plus $64.24 for rent charge at 0.00147. That's $434.28 including tax.. And before you claim you got $27,001 or $27,999 or anywhere in between the actual $27,000 NET CAP (which you claimed YOU DIDN'T GET) would = $402.98 including tax Like I said earlier, it's easier to comment on your lease deal if you post the MSRP, Cap Cost (sale price), Net Cap (sale price plus fees, minus down), Residual, Money Factor. Post those numbers and everyone will be able to see how you really did. You can pull them right off the lease contract. It will take 2 minutes.
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Replying to: stoopy (Apr 23, 2009 7:39 pm) As far as leasing v. buying, cheaper payments is one of the reasons, but I also don't want to worry about repairs outside the warranty period and trading the car in once I'm through with it, and I'd rather get a new car every three years. But that's just personal preference. How do you get $380 for 60 months on a $27,000 car? $380x60=$22800. Sixty months of payment on $27k is $450, which is close to the $100/month you were talking about. Also, I have a question for you. When I was at the dealer I asked the salesman about VW having a damage waiver and he said VW did not offer one. But he then said that they don't bother with small scratches ("less than the size of a credit card"). I asked him if that's in writing somewhere and he said it's in the contract. I asked him for a blank copy of the contract to read over before signing, which he gave to me. The contract clearly specifies "any damage." I called him about it and he said that it may not be in the contract but that's their policy and he would pull something off the VW Credit website to "ease my worries." Needless to say, although I've spoken to him a couple of times since then, he hasn't mentioned anything about it. Anything I can do to finagle a lower price out of him? Tell him I'm having second thoughts?
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Replying to: jseinfeld (Apr 24, 2009 5:23 am) As far as damage goes don't fret. Near lease end they will send you a template in the mail. It has a circle that each deep scratch must be within. Each cigarette burn must not exceed another circle, etc. etc. Basically, unless you trash the car you are good to go. Don't even think twice about it. PS: Before you sign anything LOOK OVER THE NUMBERS. I know you said you don't care about the numbers but leasing is all about the numbers. Check em out.
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so my wife and i are expecting our 1st child mid-sept, and are only interested in a relatively basic crossover/suv for as little down / monthly as possible. i've read in another post something like "a $28,000 nissan may lease for $450 /month while a $28,000 honda may lease for $350 / month, some lease better than others"... with that, can i get some opinions about the best deals out there? which crossovers/ suv's "lease best"? we've looked at the: vw tiguan (overpriced, quoted $393/month / 36 mos, 0 down, base s model) nissan rogue (quoted $330/month/ 36 mos, ttl down, base SLmodel (cloth, no premium, but awd - we also have nissan loyalty and friends/family) considering the ford escape, but no american mfg's seem to be leasing atm... also, my current lease is up end of june - which is end of dealer quarter - is it better to wait till then to negotiate?
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Replying to: on_the_cheap (Apr 25, 2009 12:14 pm) The main reason Honda, Toyota, VW don't have as good of lease deals is because most of the time you can barely get any discount off the sticker price. Also becuase they typically have way higher money factors (lease rates). There are two parts of your lease payment, depreciation and rent charge. The depreciation part of figuring your lease revolves around the residual value. The residual value of a lease is set by the leasing company. You want it to be as high as possible but it's normallly between 45-60% on SUV's. You multiply that number of say 50% times the MSRP. So if a $30,000 VW Tiguan has a residual value of 50% then the residual is $15,000. You then subtract the residual of $15,000 from the SELLING PRICE of the vehicle. Let's say you negotiated a selling price of $27,000 on the VW. Then you add the acquistion fee of $595 so your net cap (sale price plus fees) is $27,595. $27,595 minus $15,000 equals $12,595 which you then divide by the term of 36 payments. As you can see you are already at $349.86. Not good. The rent charge portion is the net cap (sale price plus fee(s) of $27,595) plus the residual $15,000 times the money factor .00147 (set by leasing company). i.e. $27,595 + $15,000 X .00147 = $62.61. $349.86 plus $62.61 = YOUR BASE MONTHLY PAYMENT OF $412.47 NOT INCLUDING SALES TAX. Add even 7% sales tax and your payment is $441.34 Ways to get a lower payment. 1. Find vehicles that are heavily discounted off the sticker price. Ford, Chevy, Subaru, Dodge can get you $5-9.000 off the sticker without blinking an eye. That Subaru Tribeca I mentioned has an MSRP of about $33,000 and sells for $26,000. 2. Find a vehicle with a high residual value. 3. Find a vehicle with a money factor of below 0.00175. You don't necessarily have to have all 3 things but definitely 2 of 3.
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Replying to: stoopy (Apr 26, 2009 1:19 am) i'm near Detroit and can probably get an A plan on any American make, but i hear none are leasing right now. we have not shopped Subaru at all, but they are now on the list! |
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Replying to: stoopy (Apr 24, 2009 6:40 pm) MSRP: 29,924 Cap Cost: 26,497.12 Net Cap: 27,770.35 Total Cap: 28,329.71 Residual: 15,859.72 Money Factor: .00147 Monthly Depreciation: 330.85 Monthly Rental: 64.14 Monthly Payment: 394.99 Sales Tax: 956.60 Luxury Tax (?!): $105.99 (I'm going to ask them to take this off - what the hell is this nonsense?) Bank Fee: 575 Other fee: 195 (should I ask for this to come off as well? Sounds shady) Cap Reduction: 559.36 Total Depreciation: 11,910.63 As you can see, it looks like they made the residual way lower - it's 57% of the Net Cap. These numbers are a little off because they were run prior to the grad program being mentioned, but you get the idea. Thanks in advance for your input.
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Replying to: jseinfeld (Apr 26, 2009 7:07 pm) You see that you are putting down $559.36 right? This makes your pre-down Cap Cost Meaning you are only $1600 under MSRP.
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