Article Comments - 2009 Lincoln MKS First Drive / Full Test

154 messages, Last post on Nov 17, 2008 at 2:21 PM

You are in the Lincoln MKS Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Lincoln MKS, Sedan

First Drive: 2009 Lincoln MKS - First Impressions: The world's most completely equipped Taurus/Taurus X/Sable/Volvo/Flex, which turns out to be not such a bad thing. (more)

Full Test: 2009 Lincoln MKS AWD - Bottom Line: A luxury sedan for the Ford faithful, but all others would be advised to look elsewhere as there are far better luxury sedans for the price. (more)

Outline

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#105 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [akirby] by nvbanker Sep 03, 2008 (9:55 am)
Replying to: akirby (Sep 03, 2008 9:14 am) You're right - the transaxle has to be slightly in front of or behind the engine unless you have a really tall engine bay, or a short engine (pushrod). Then, you start messing with driving dynamics, handling, cornering, centers of gravity. All of this is why if you want a handler, you need RWD to really balance it. This car won't be that, but isn't priced to be that either. Again, it's not the LS - don't expect it to be. But for what it is, it's pretty darn good, in my opinion. If you want a luxurious cruiser that's good in the snow....for a decent price, you got it here.
#106 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [akirby] by gregg_vw Sep 03, 2008 (10:12 am)
Replying to: akirby (Sep 03, 2008 9:14 am) You are right, it is not. But I think that is a bit of the problem. Transverse engines on the drive wheels is a layout shared with econoboxes and other plebeian rides. In that configuration, a good portion of the engine often hangs in front of the front wheels. For many years, Audi was an also-ran when compared to BMW and Mercedes. However, even though they stuck with the FWD layout, they adopted a north-south engine layout and added AWD. THey undercut BMW and M-B in price and over quite a few years, built the A6 into a car with interior quality considered the industry standard, and handling characteristics improved by moving the engine back a bit. The price went up as the reputation did. It now outsells both the midsize Mercedes and BMW models by a lot. But others have a chance here. Audi has become complacent with the A6 styling and it is no longer the bargain it once was. There's an opening here for Lincoln, but the MKS is not likely it. The MKS is too big and too tall to directly compete against the foreign makes, all of whom run from 188" to 194" inches in length. (OK, the Genesis and Chrysler 300 run 196", but they like the MKS are full-sized cars.) The MKZ is not designed to cover that field either, even though it is more the right size. Lincoln can probably make money on the MKS with a lower volume, but how will Lincoln ever build its brand and prestige without a single volume model? At 30,000 units a year, the MKS is not it, and even that volume is likely to decrease once it has been out a couple of years, and "pent-up demand" is met. Lincoln used to sell tons of Town Cars, and Navigators. The Continental sold well in its time, and even the LS did better than 50,000 its first year. The Mark III on up series did that well or better. I suppose it was hoped that the MKZ could be a volume model, but that has not turned out to be the case. In any event, the MKS had to cover too many markets what with the LS gone, the Town Car fleet only, and no Continental (nor coupe nor convertible) in sight. They cannot get an MKR to market fast enough. Replies to this message: akirby (Sep 03, 2008 11:40 am) gregg_vw (Sep 03, 2008 11:56 am) akirby (Sep 03, 2008 12:29 pm)
#107 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [gdmstrb] by brucelinc Sep 03, 2008 (10:49 am)
Replying to: gdmstrb (Sep 03, 2008 8:28 am) What this vehicle truly needs is an Ecoboost'd version with a true Sports Package. Heck why not offer one on the non-turbo'd version as well. I am all for suspension options. I would love it if they would offer the adjustable dampers like they do on the Volvo S80. If you are suggesting a true sports package to improve handling, it would take a lot more than suspension tweaks. A 61.5 inch high, 4300 pound sedan with 61/39 weight distribution is simply not going to compete with sport packaged sedans with more favorable specs. A Sports Package with paddle shifters, more aggressive seats, and some other appearance touches might appeal to some folks who are more into looks than razor sharp handling. Some of the reviews have complained about the ride quality. So have many potential customers who were expecting soft luxury. If they do offer a sportier (firmer) suspension option, they should probably soften up the base version a tad. One of my concerns is that when the Ecoboost arrives, it will include a stiffer suspension. That would ruin it for me. With the 19 or 20 inch wheels, the MKS already has a choppier ride than an LS.
#108 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [gregg_vw] by akirby Sep 03, 2008 (11:40 am)
Replying to: gregg_vw (Sep 03, 2008 10:12 am) I agree 100% (for a change). I think they need to get 100% unique sheetmetal for the MKZ along with a MKS style interior and all (or at least most) of the same luxury features. Offer the 4 cylinder and/or hybrid to give folks the option of luxury in a more fuel efficient package. Sounds like Mercury will be filling the bill with smaller luxury vehicles which should help a lot as long as they're not U.S. Ford clones and offer suitable performance, fuel economy and features. That leaves GRWD which should produce a 2 door coupe (Mark VIII), 4 door midsize performance sedan to go toe to toe with 5-series, E class, etc. and a larger RWD flagship. Fix the MKX just like the MKZ and throw in a revised Navigator with better fuel efficiency (3.5L EB?) and I think that's a good lineup. The nich vehicles can come later. Replies to this message: gregg_vw (Sep 03, 2008 11:56 am) akirby (Sep 03, 2008 12:29 pm)
#109 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [akirby] by gregg_vw Sep 03, 2008 (11:56 am)
Replying to: akirby (Sep 03, 2008 11:40 am) What you said. Trouble is, there are a lot of folks who believe the GRWD has been pushed back many years or even cancelled. Lincoln's experience with the MKZ and now the MKS should underscore for them the necessity of pushing forward with what you suggest: 4 door midsize performance sedan to go toe to toe with 5-series, E class, etc. and a larger RWD flagship. Plus a coupe. (Everyone else has a coupe.) MKX and MKZ would be fine if made real Lincolns. The Navigator could get a quick "boost" by adopting the 09 F150 body (with Lincoln body panels) and an EcoBoost engine. Here's hoping someone is listening. Replies to this message: akirby (Sep 03, 2008 12:29 pm)
#110 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [gregg_vw] by akirby Sep 03, 2008 (12:29 pm)
Replying to: gregg_vw (Sep 03, 2008 11:56 am) I firmly believe that is Mulally and Kuzak's plan, but they just don't have the resources to pull it off quickly. As for GRWD, an insider just confirmed that it is a done deal - the only question now is what it will be used for, specifically. I could potentially see Ford staying with D3 but I think Lincoln will be moving to GRWD as we suggested, but it will probably take 3 years or longer. Lack of platform and drivetrain development in the early part of the century is really killing them now.
#111 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [gdmstrb] by pmerk28 Sep 03, 2008 (1:17 pm)
Replying to: gdmstrb (Sep 03, 2008 8:28 am) The problem for Linoln is that people want 5 series BMW's and E Class Benzes without really caring if they are the best cars in their class or not. Replies to this message: gregg_vw (Sep 04, 2008 4:41 am) pmerk28 (Sep 04, 2008 6:53 am) akirby (Sep 04, 2008 7:54 am) and 4 more...
#112 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [gdmstrb] by exalteddragon1 Sep 03, 2008 (6:16 pm)
Replying to: gdmstrb (Sep 03, 2008 8:28 am) Its true that many people don't find Lincoln to be an attractive name anymore. I think it is, and it can have the high cachet it once enjoyed. The problem is with the vehicles, not the brand. This car comes so close its shocking. Then they decide to mess up the details. Its a shame. I still want to like this car, though. Replies to this message: pmerk28 (Sep 03, 2008 8:26 pm) exalteddragon1 (Sep 04, 2008 5:38 pm) akirby (Sep 05, 2008 4:55 am) and 32 more...
#113 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [exalteddragon1] by pmerk28 Sep 03, 2008 (8:26 pm)
Replying to: exalteddragon1 (Sep 03, 2008 6:16 pm) Details cost money which Ford does not have. Replies to this message: exalteddragon1 (Sep 04, 2008 5:38 pm) akirby (Sep 05, 2008 4:55 am) exalteddragon1 (Sep 05, 2008 4:03 pm) and 31 more...
#114 of 154 Re: I Don't Get It..... [pmerk28] by gregg_vw Sep 04, 2008 (4:41 am)
Replying to: pmerk28 (Sep 03, 2008 1:17 pm) Yes, and Lincoln needs to figure out how to develop some of that want for the Lincoln brand. After all, it is all about what people want and are willing to pay for. Replies to this message: pmerk28 (Sep 04, 2008 6:53 am) akirby (Sep 04, 2008 7:54 am) nvbanker (Sep 04, 2008 9:37 am) and 3 more...