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Automotive News & Views Are The Japanese Poised to Dethrone the 911 AND the Z06?
194 messages, Last post on Nov 24, 2008 at 12:05 PM
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Mar 12, 2008 10:30 am) I have no idea what prompted you to post this. BMW races in F1, where the engine architecture is a V-10 not an I6. They race their I6 in their WTCC events, but then again, so does Chevrolet with their Chevy Malibu. A V6 is always inherently better in design than an I6. More compact, smoother, better COG. Why an automaker would want to go with an I6 is beyond me.
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Mar 12, 2008 2:53 pm) When Nissan makes a "front-midship" design with a V8 instead of a V6 in their sportscars like Chevrolet does then come talk to me. |
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Mar 12, 2008 2:53 pm) 
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Mar 10, 2008 3:12 pm) On what, a surface that even Edmunds admits was flawed? From their own and only test of the GT-R, folks: "Our test was conducted on a fairly low-grip surface that produced lots of rear wheelspin before the GT-R's sophisticated all-wheel-drive system engaged the front wheels..."And in the same paragraph of the same test, folks: "Due to their lack of all-wheel drive, the Dodge Viper and Corvette Z06 are held back by traction limitations." (Then one sentence later, Edmunds shows serious errors in their competence with this: "Once impressive, [the Z06's] 4.1-second 0-60-mph run and 12-second quarter-mile at 121.8 mph are now well off the pace, which is why Chevy is creating the supercharged Corvette ZR1." Truth of the matter is, is that the ZR-1 was created because Bob Lutz promises us that GM will never make any of his cars more powerful than the Corvette. Since the Cadillac CTS-V will have more power than the current Corvette Z06 (550 vs. 505), Bob Lutz was forced into creating the ZR-1 for that reason and that reason alone. By the same token, the previous CTS-V used the same LS6 engine as the Z06, but had to be detuned 15 horsepower on purpose just to make it less powerful than the Vette). " Uhhh... that includes the 1/4-mile time." Edmunds gets the GT-R to 120 MPH  11.6. They got the Z06 to 122 MPH 12 (authorities attribute Edmunds 12-second figure for the Z06 attributed to wheelspin at launch). Your incorrect data therefore suggests you might be biased towards the GT-R. Furthermore, Motor Trend got the following speeds for the Z06: 11.7 seconds at 125 mph and a top speed of 198 mph. Car and Driver got roughly the same numbers, which all means that the Z06 is already faster than the GT-R in both acceleration and top speed. "Why do you think its not skewed when the Corvette has been launched thousands of times by different drivers and the GT-R has been launched what? Twice? With enough practice, a good GT-R driver should put up high-2s as well." Again, the only reason why the obese GT-R is getting a 0-60 run in under 5 seconds is because of its AWD system. AWD systems permit about 1.5 times as much traction as RWD drivetrains. Thus, since the AWD system of the GT-R provides so much grip for the car, the GT-R will never test its limits of adhesion. For this reason, the quoted 3.6 seconds to 60 MPH will be the lowest figure any driver will ever get out of the car. Contrast this to the 2.8 second run to 60 MPH LPE got with a stock Z06 with Sonoco Blue. Again, there is potential for the current stock Z06 to run quicker 1/4 mile times, but there is no potential for the GT-R to do the same for the reason explained above. "AWD... pulls the front end around corners while the rear end pushes. This particular AWD system can transfer torque to the outside wheels to push it around corners even faster. That means when your front-heavy 'Vette driver has to let off to keep from oversteering and smoking the tires, the GT-R driver can keep powering through." This may be true if we're racing these cars to the summit of Pike's Peak in a rally race of some sort (think Subaru), but it is not the case on a normal road course. You say that the Corvette oversteers. If anything, it would be the rear-engine cars that are most suseptible to oversteer (this is all Cars 101, BTW...). Yet we never hear of the AWD Ferrari Challenge Stradale and never heard of the Acura NSX AWD. The best Porsche -- the GT3 -- is not an AWD car. There is an AWD 911, but the vehicle is clumsy compared to the GT3. An AWD system can never compete with the RWD setup on any track, except track racing in inclement weather or dirt roads. "And it was Fifth Gear, not Top gear." You are correct. It was Fifth Gear; not Top Gear that "tested" the GT-R. |
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Mar 12, 2008 5:35 am) A Boxter, for example, isn't any better than the S2000 or Sky RedLine, yet it costs about the same as a Vette. I don't see how a German econo-box can cost as much as a Corvette, but it does... Let's hope this new GT-R will aid in the overall price reductions of overly expensive European sports cars. And let's face it: Price a Carrera the same price as a Corvette and it's no longer an exotic. Same car, different price tag, reduction in status. This is a sad but true fact and once again illustrates that the wealthiest people in our society are also the dumbest. |
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Replying to: bumpy (Mar 12, 2008 4:39 pm) Nissan calls their new platform FM, for Front Midship. The name is a trademark, even though the design is used widely. The term you are looking for is "Front-mid-engine-rear-wheel-drive" or FMR layout. Which includes the BMW Z-4. With an I-6 up front as it were. And the 3-series all have a 50-50 weight balance. I'm aware of its advantages. This is a sad but true fact and once again illustrates that the wealthiest people in our society are also the dumbest. I'll drink to that! There's no reason why good performing cars have to be 'exclusive'. I honestly don't care if its the lightweight Corvette or the AWD GT-R that's slightly faster. I'm sure we'd agree that there is probably a scenario in which one/other shines. They are here to prove that performance can be affordable.
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Replying to: pmc4 (Mar 12, 2008 4:23 pm) Wow, that's just completely wrong. 
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Mar 12, 2008 5:38 pm) Sorry, the Z4 doesn't qualify. 
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Replying to: bumpy (Mar 12, 2008 6:26 pm) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FMR_layout
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