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Mazda5: No Traction/ Stability Control. Is this an issue?

78 messages,  Last post on Jan 06, 2012 at 9:26 PM

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What is this discussion about? Mazda MAZDA5, Car Safety, Van

Messages Page 4 of 8

#31 of 78 Re: Mazda5: No Traction/ Stability Control. Is this an issue? [athenasius] by researchqueen

Mar 31, 2008 (11:34 am)

Replying to: athenasius (Mar 05, 2008 8:34 pm)
I agree with you (ahtenasius)... the fact that only cars with ESC are even considered for safety awards, plus the fact that the technology has been mandated on all cars sold in the U.S. by 2012, should tell the public something. ESC is considered the biggest potential lifesaver since the seat belt, at least from what I'm reading (Full disclosure: I work for Edmunds.) Is it a big deal that it's not on the MAZDA5? Hell yeah, it is. This is exactly the segment I'm looking at: I need an inxpensive car that has 6 or more seats, so the MAZDA5 and the Kia Rondo are high on my list. I'd probably buy the 5 tomorrow, except for the fact that it lacks ESC. Even in L.A., where the weather is good, it's something I want, because they drive like lunatics here and I want every safety feature possible for my kids. I'm sure I'm not the only one, and so Mazda will lose sales because of it. It just seems so short-sighted. It's too bad: I really like the zoom-zoom!

#32 of 78 Re: Mazda5: No Traction/ Stability Control. Is this an issue? [researchquee by coolmazda5

Mar 31, 2008 (12:39 pm)

Replying to: researchqueen (Mar 31, 2008 11:34 am)
researchqueen,
 
I'm with you, the Zoom-Zoom (along with manual transmission and the safety features, yeah, except ESC) have been on top of my list when buying a Mazda5. There are several articles out there related to the Mazda5 but I recalled at least one where Mazda indicates that it has listened closely to the NA market for the 08 model (I can attest it, the great majority of my 2006 Mazda5 car "gripes" have been addressed on my 2008 Mazda5 model, like more armrests, 2nd row A/C, more visible dashboard gauges, 5AT for the Auto tranny owners, minor engine enhancements, other bug fixes, etc.).
 
So I'm wondering if this market has really pushed for ESC , especially with feedback like yours, a person who works for Edmunds. If I am a Mazda Product Manager, heck, I would be allover media feedback (Edmunds included of course) of my cars, that is for sure.
 
Or maybe the ESC need feedback has not fallen into the right Mazda hands...

#33 of 78 The end of the story? No by autoholic75

Apr 02, 2008 (11:55 am)

Replying to: coolmazda5 (Mar 26, 2008 11:19 am)
This might be the end of the story for you... as you have your new car now and seem to be pleased. (BTW I appreciate all of your input as an owner with everyday experience).
 
However, for those of us shopping now and considering all the different auto models now, I think this is a significant and influential issue. I also refuse to stop "beating this dead horse" because I want Mazda to hear my voice and know that DSC is needed in the upcoming '09 version. I really do like this car, and as I stated before, I would buy one in a heartbeat -but only if it comes with DSC. My fall back is Sienna -but I would rather not have such a huge gas hog as our primary mover in a big city.
 
In your post it was implied that DSC is need only in SUVs, did I read that right? I have to respectfully disagree on this, and would propose that this tech system is a real benefit to any auto and should be provided in all. Yes it can most help in “toppy”, high cog vehicles like the CX-7, but it most benefits the ER lane change/split second avoidance maneuver that, when done at hwy speeds, can lead to loss of control in any car. I know this all too well from personal experience. Back in ’93 I destroyed a Chrysler Lebaron (and nearly myself). Had that car been equipped w/ DSC, I am confident I could have avoided my 9 days in the hospital.
 
Most car manufacturers already recognize this logic and have adopted DSC as standard across the line, even at the economy levels. Consider even Kia, which provides DSC for the similar Rondo. Now I personally have no passion for this car and will not buy, but it is frustrating to know that this less expensive alternative has a more advanced safety options suite.
 
Finally, remember that even if you think of yourself as a superbly safe driver and can live without such superfluous technology - know that not having it now will affect the resale value of the car down the road. Recall the trend that came with the airbag back in the early 90's and how not having one impacted the cars used sale/trade in. "Does it have an airbag?" This was one of the first questions asked by buyers from that time – and many chose to buy less expensive new cars with the latest safety options over quality used without for this very reason.

#34 of 78 Re: The end of the story? No [autoholic75] by coolmazda5

Apr 02, 2008 (5:53 pm)

Replying to: autoholic75 (Apr 02, 2008 11:55 am)
a)
I would suggest to direct your comments to MAZDA if you want to be heard: www.mazda.com or www.mazdausa.com (They also have 800 numbers for the US). You may have realized by this time that here you won't get too far. Also, you are typing words I've never used, so do not IMPLY anything about my posts (superfluous technology?, superbly safe driver?)
 
b)
I don't own 1 Mazda5, but 2 Mazda5s (a 2006 and a 2008). Was I really concerned about DSC after owning one for almost 3 years? NO. Do I think DSC a good thing to have? YES, but not a critical one for a Mazda5 IMO. Do I think SUVs really need it more than a Mazda5? YES. There is something called gravity center and guess where SUVs have it compared to a Mazda5. As per a 1993 model, I think 15 years of engineering have improved the way cars are designed even when you don't include DSC...
 
c)
Resale value. I really squeeze the value out of my cars before I sell them so resale value is not my concern. And by the way, regardless, I got almost double the money out of my trade-in value (A Honda without DSC) than any trade-in value for a similar year/model with DSC plus all the top trim toys (Ford, GM, Nissan or Chrysler, just compare it on a Blue Book, don't take my word)
 
d)
As I mentioned it earlier, if you are concerned today, buy a car w/ DSC now, even a Rondo, serious, please do not wait to see if Mazda comes with it next year and continue being at risk for another year. I don't work for Mazda so I don't get a cent for my comments, it is just a solicited opinion.
 
e)
And drive safe, ABS, DSC, ESC, Traction Control, XYZ, ABC won't save you if you drive carelessly...

#35 of 78 Re: The end of the story? No [coolmazda5] by nahag1

Apr 03, 2008 (12:23 pm)

Replying to: coolmazda5 (Apr 02, 2008 5:53 pm)
Ditto coolmazda5, couldn't have said it better!! Drive safe.
For a car this size with a 2.3 engine and at this price, everything you get as standard on a 5 should be enough.
Else, you can get whatever you want if you're willing to pay the price.
As for the "Le Baron", try driving today a car with such a sensitive hydraulic steering, you'll see how dangerous that kind of power steering used to be.

#36 of 78 Mazda5 Stabilty Control by italian_jamoke

Apr 03, 2008 (5:57 pm)

Replying to: nahag1 (Apr 03, 2008 12:23 pm)
Do you all know why Mazda doesn't offer stablity control? BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO. The Mazda 5 is the only vehicle of its kind in America. People will buy it, even if it doesn't have stablity control. They'll even buy it without having any crash data available. Believe me, Mazda will offer it as soon as one of two things happen:
 
1) Another mini-mini van (with sliding doors) is available in America that has it.
 
2) It's required by law.
 
The only choices I have right now are the Kia Rondo and the Mazda 5. If you care about safety, like I do, then why would you buy a vehicle in which there is no crash data available, and no stablity control offered (even as an option). The stablity control is available in Europe. Hmmm, I wonder why? BECAUSE THEY HAVE COMPETITION IN THAT MARKET SEGMENT IN EUROPE. They will be losing another sale by me, but it won't matter much to them. They'll make their quota, and wait untill they're forced to offer it. All it does for me is make me not want to buy a Mazda ever again. I'm zooming to another manufacturer...

#37 of 78 Re: Mazda5 Stabilty Control [italian_jamoke] by coolmazda5

Apr 04, 2008 (8:43 am)

Replying to: italian_jamoke (Apr 03, 2008 5:57 pm)
LOL, this is the longest thread I've ever seen on a simple topic, but I'll keep feeding the troll , it is interesting. At least this last reply has a more down to earth explanation of why, I admit .
 
KIA should be happy to read all this though, but regardless, I won't see a KIA (nor my wife) on my shopping list for a long time, those things are as ugly as sin, and yeah, I've read a lot of stories around KIA post-sales quality issues regardless of their "initial" quality claims (new cars). For that matter, I would prefer to buy exactly the same car I already have, again (which I did)...

#38 of 78 Re: Mazda5 Stabilty Control [italian_jamoke] by coolmazda5

Apr 04, 2008 (10:12 am)

Replying to: italian_jamoke (Apr 03, 2008 5:57 pm)
If you care about safety, like I do, then why would you buy a vehicle in which there is no crash data available
 
And by the way, Really?? There are no NHTSA NA centric crash test results, but the Mazda5 passed the Japanese NCAP and EuroNCAP crash tests with the highest ratings (BMW, Volvo, Honda or even Renault in Europe and Japan would be a good comparison point)
 
If NHTSA would not look at these global tests I'm sure the NA market would be already flooded with Chinese or Indian cars, honest.
 
See the source:
 
Mazda5 Wins Highest Crash Safety Rating from EU and Japanese New Car Testing Agencies
http://www.japancorp.net/Article.asp?Art_ID=12380

#39 of 78 Re: Mazda5 Stabilty Control [coolmazda5] by autoholic75

Apr 04, 2008 (11:00 am)

Replying to: coolmazda5 (Apr 04, 2008 8:43 am)
KIA should be happy to read all this though, but regardless, I won't see a KIA (nor my wife) on my shopping list for a long time, those things are as ugly as sin, and yeah, I've read a lot of stories around KIA post-sales quality issues regardless of their "initial" quality claims (new cars). For that matter, I would prefer to buy exactly the same car I already have, again (which I did)...
 
Well on this at least we can agree. No Kia for me either. Fine car, but like I said, after close inspection at the Chicago auto show, I walked away unimpressed. I think the fact that the rear seats would not fold down without the headrest being removed kinda stuck in my craw. That, and no sliding doors. It’s always the little things (but I think this may be for another forum).
 
I would like to point out that there will be more competition in this segment in the near term, especially with gas already approaching $4 here. Looking at the Sienna, not sure we really need a grocery getter with 260 ponies. The new Dodge Journey comes to mind (again DSC stnd) and one might consider the third row RA4 as well (I test drove this too), again DSC stnd. I wouldn't be surprised if we also see more similar sized >5 people movers, yet to be announced. Stranger things have happened. Seems to me that, although there is no direct competition (sliding door), there is enough out there to lure one away from (what some might consider) a less safe family car. (A nod to the UK test standards for the outstanding results, but even then DSC is needed for “full credit”).
 
I am lucky that I have no immediate need and can wait to see just what the market shakes out for 09. In the mean time, as I said before, I have already contacted Mazda by email and as well by snail mail – and in both I make my case for what I want to see in the next iteration of the 5. Your point is made that this forum possibly serves little effect on Mazda’s corporate decisions, but it helps me to vent on the issue anyway. My #1 choice is definitely a Mazda 5, but I will be eagerly watching the posts for just how it will be packaged. No DSC will likely mean a Sienna and a lost sale for Mazda.

#40 of 78 Lack of DSC by jonat1x

May 09, 2008 (11:28 pm)

Our 2008 Touring is our first new car in nine years, prompted by my wife's new job some 40 miles distant. The 5 is our only car - family of 6. I would have preferred DSC/ESC but was reassured by foreign test results and the fact that this vehicle is incredibly sure-footed - from the perspective of having driven for 36 years, I would speculate that any maneuver extreme enough to roll the 5 would defeat DSC/ESC if it were actually available - I have utter confidence in the dynamics of this vehicle.

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