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SUVs Mitsubishi Outlander Mitsubishi Outlander vs. Subaru Forester
826 messages, Last post on Nov 30, 2009 at 7:21 AM
You are in the Mitsubishi Outlander Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & tidester
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You say yes, he says no He says stop and you say go, go, go Oh, no! Hey, guys, this bickering is becoming distracting. Can we let it go?  tidester, host SUVs and Smart Shopper |
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Replying to: tidester (Nov 09, 2009 11:25 pm) 
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Replying to: tidester (Nov 09, 2009 11:25 pm) 
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Replying to: tidester (Nov 09, 2009 11:25 pm) Tidester, are you taking sides and comparing us? Once you've said here "We are comparing vehicles and not people!" Your last comment generated 2 more posts irrelevant to the subject we were discussing, and "he" did not "stop" after all, but instead he made a post irrelevat to the topic. But let's get back to the actual topic. Tidester, do you have anything to say about any relevance of Borg Warner AWD system to the Outlander?
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Replying to: chelentano (Nov 10, 2009 12:41 pm) Absolutely not. Tidester, do you have anything to say about any relevance of Borg Warner AWD system to the Outlander? Only to the extent that the discussion remain friendly, informative and peaceful. tidester, host SUVs and Smart Shopper
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Replying to: tidester (Nov 10, 2009 3:57 pm) The GEMA alliance meant parts sharing for cost efficiencies. I don't think it would make any sense at all for that joint venture to source 3 different AWD systems, from the same supplier no less, in this case Borg Warner. chelentano says I'm fabricating this, and he's entitled to his opinion. For me this is common sense, call it inference, not fabrication. He's sending me on a fool's errand, to find a source to confirm these are the same, but of course each manufacturer wants to brand their system differently, and Borg Warner would lose money if they don't play along. I'm no fool, so I make the logical deduction that Borg Warner supplies the same system to this alliance's near-identical powertrains. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. I do not need to see a DNA test to identify a duck, though others may and I guess what tidester is saying is I have to respect that, so I will. If he wants to believe that Borg Warner gives Mitsubishi preferential treatment and supplies them with a superior AWD system to use with the same basic 2.4l engine and CVT transmission, then that's fine with me, we can agree to disagree. Cheers. |
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Speaking of fools' errands, I checked out the card recommended here (by guess who?), and read the fine print. Did you know that the 3% rebate only applies to the first $600 in monthly purchases? So you're only earning 3% up to $18. Then it drops to just 1%. No thanks, I'll keep my Chase Subaru card. I used $1500 to lower the price of my purchase, and already have $600 saved up for free service, accessories, etc. That lowers TCO even more.
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>> The GEMA alliance meant parts sharing for cost efficiencies. I don't think it would make any sense at all for that joint venture to source 3 different AWD systems, from the same supplier no less, in this case Borg Warner. Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance was not evolved with AWD systems, just engines. >> For me this is common sense, call it inference, not fabrication. He's sending me on a fool's errand, to find a source to confirm these are the same, but of course each manufacturer wants to brand their system differently, and Borg Warner would lose money if they don't play along. It’s not a “common sense”, it’s just a subjective speculation. Speaking of “common sense”, why Mitsubishi would be so special to require such a secrecy? Porsche, Hyundai, Acura, Ford and Mercedes - all openly use some form of Borg Warner AWD technology. BMW and Subaru also openly use Mitsubishi turbochargers. And this kind of information is not easy to hide anyway: “if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck “. To me “common sense” is that Mitsubishi already owns excellent Dakar tested AWD technology and it has no need to buy it from someone else. >> If he wants to believe that Borg Warner gives Mitsubishi preferential treatment and supplies them with a superior AWD system … No need to “believe”, just facts please, that would be a common sense.
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Replying to: chelentano (Nov 12, 2009 1:56 am) I don't understand the sentence about Dakar ... Mitsu outsources the AWD, Borg Warner supplies it. We'll just have to agree to disagree.
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Replying to: ateixeira (Nov 12, 2009 6:36 am) Just like Subaru, Mitsubishi develops and builds their AWD and 4WD technology in-house (this includes their AYC, ACD, ASC, ABS, and the system that integrates them all to produce S-AWC). They do not use Borg-Warner's system, one of the reasons being the integration of the aforementioned technologies. In fact, the company has no relationship with Borg-Warner. For example, Mitsubishi sources their dual-clutch TC-SST from German transmission maker Getrag. This tranny will be available on the European-spec Outlander equipped with the PSA sourced 2.2l diesel starting in December (why would Mitsubishi adapt a Borg-Warner AWD system to a Getrag dual-clutch transmission when they could get an all-in-one solution?). FWIW, I in my humble opinion the Forester and the Outlander (especially the freshened 2010) are the top 2 picks in the small CUV category.
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