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SUVs Mitsubishi Outlander Mitsubishi Outlander vs. Subaru Forester
804 messages, Last post on Nov 26, 2009 at 11:55 AM
You are in the Mitsubishi Outlander Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & tidester
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Replying to: dcm61 (May 15, 2008 11:24 am) I personally bought an AWD car for safety, so why would I want to pay extra for a switch to disable a safety feature? AWD on a nicely paved dry pavement is pretty much useless in everyday driving. Notice how difficult it is to buy a 4WD version of Outlander in summer states such as Texas, Florida, Arizona. Also, switching to constant 2WD mode is useful here in NJ during summertime as it saves you about 2-4MPG depending on driving conditions. Subaru has a different philosophy but I like Mitsubishis philosophy better. Sure the computer can sort the AWD system for you but computer is a computer, there are always glitches and no AWD system is perfect. So all in all I like th eoption to disable 4WD as I please just like I like the option to disable stability control. I actually like when car allows for human input and is not all computer controlled. And speaking of AWD systems, while I realize Subaru has been developing them for a while, currently it's the Mitsubishi that offers a better AWD system in it's Evo X (Subaru has nothing better) and Subaru also has nothing on Montero/Pajero SuperselectII 4x4 system. All those systems are Mitsubishis. So I am more than sure that the AWD system found in the Outlander is more advanced than Fords.
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Replying to: blitzkrieg79 (May 15, 2008 11:32 am) Look at the EVO - it has summer tires, yet AWD is a core part of it. Would you buy a FWD Lancer EVO? AWD is more balanced that FWD. You have less tendency to understeer, better balance, and it reduces or even eliminates torque steer. So I am more than sure that the AWD system found in the Outlander is more advanced than Fords So let me get this straight - the EVO and Pajero are great cars, so the Outlander has a good AWD system? Only if they are the same can you make that claim. They're not the same, though. The Lexus LX/Toyota Land Cruiser have awesome 4WD systems but the one in the Toyota Sienna is lousy.
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Replying to: blitzkrieg79 (May 15, 2008 11:32 am) I wouldn't base AWD's all-encompasing safety ability on who buys what where. Just because the hot states go cheap because 'everyday' driving doesn't include snow, does not mean that you can't power out of an 'oh hell' situation on dry pavement. Try cutting a hard left around a deer/car/child that just jumped in the road at point blank and then steer back right on course by adding power with FWD. Bye. Sometimes driving involves dodging things and cornering harder than one had expected to at that precise moment. I would never drive an AWD vehicle in 2WD mode if I could help it. A properly tuned AWD system is just as useful for getting you out of trouble on dry pavement as it is for a performance enhancer. |
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Replying to: ateixeira (May 15, 2008 12:00 pm) Look at the EVO - it has summer tires, yet AWD is a core part of it. Would you buy a FWD Lancer EVO? AWD is more balanced that FWD. You have less tendency to understeer, better balance, and it reduces or even eliminates torque steer. First off, the AWD system in Evo is a bit different than anything in this class, Evo X AWD system can compare to cars costing twice as much. Second of all, AWD on a dry pavement matters only if you are driving "enthusiastically" on a nice twisty road. 99% of drivers drive on straight highways/streets. AWD helps with traction in bad weather such as sleet/rain/snow but on a nice summer dry day with average Joe behind an average errand from home to work and vice versa AWD system is almost useless... So let me get this straight - the EVO and Pajero are great cars, so the Outlander has a good AWD system? Only if they are the same can you make that claim. They're not the same, though. The Lexus LX/Toyota Land Cruiser have awesome 4WD systems but the one in the Toyota Sienna is lousy. The Evo and Pajero comment was a response to someone comparing the Outlanders AWD system to outdated Fords AWD with a dial. So I brought up two Mitsubishi cars to show that when its all said and done Mitsubishis best AWD systems are superior to Subarus. Subaru enthusiasts think that Subarus AWD systems are the best in the world when in fact they are far from it. They build their image around AWD systems but that does not mean they are anywhere near the top. I can name at least 3 other systems that are better than anything Subaru makes, namely S-AWC (Mitsu), ATTESA (Nissan), SH-AWD (Honda). So before you will criticize Outlanders unknown AWD system read up on what Subarus AWD systems are really about. It's just like Audi, they built their brand recognition in the 1980s with the Quattro AWD systems and people to this day remember it and think its the best in the world when in fact it's outdated and Audi is no where near best AWD systems these days (they mainly use Haldex/Torsen AWD systems which are FWD biased). I am not saying that Subaru makes bad AWD systems, I am just saying they are not as advanced as the mentioned competition. |
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Replying to: biscuit_xls (May 15, 2008 11:19 am) Wrong, I'm discussing the Forester, except where noted for a specific model. The issues we've been discussing, in case you missed it, are outside of the realm of a test drive. Skidpad, 0 to 60, AWD inner workings and capabilties, etc. Exactly which item is the test drive going to elucidate. So let's not call the kettle black.
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Replying to: blitzkrieg79 (May 15, 2008 12:27 pm) It does do those things you mentioned, but it also helps with accident avoidance. You can consider accident avoidance very similar to 'enthusiastic' driving. The connection is very easy to make actually. When someone on here claims AWD is a safety aid, it is not because they expect to be on a straight, flat, well-paved road without any disturbances or driver errors. It is because all of a sudden, for no reason at all, there is a dog in the middle of that straight, flat road and not enough time to stop. Gotta swerve? You shoulda gotten AWD. Your options are understeer into the dog, or get caught in transitional understeer and not be able to recover before going off the road completely and rolling over in a drainage ditch and drowning. It works in more vehicles than the EVO. Different systems, same objective. Its not useless by any means.
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Replying to: kdshapiro (May 15, 2008 12:39 pm) Wrong, I'm discussing the Forester, except where noted for a specific model. The issues we've been discussing, in case you missed it, are outside of the realm of a test drive. Skidpad, 0 to 60, AWD inner workings and capabilties, etc. Exactly which item is the test drive going to elucidate. So let's not call the kettle black. Yeah biscuit, what's wrong with you? It's not whether the thing works in real life, it's all about armchair racing and spec quoting from the internet. The nerve !!! 
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Replying to: bigmclargehuge (May 15, 2008 12:42 pm) When someone on here claims AWD is a safety aid, it is not because they expect to be on a straight, flat, well-paved road without any disturbances or driver errors. It is because all of a sudden, for no reason at all, there is a hippopotamus in the middle of that straight, flat road and not enough time to stop. Gotta swerve? You shoulda gotten AWD. It works in more vehicles than the EVO. Different systems, same objective. Its not useless by any means. Well AWD does help in accident avoidance but again, last time anything that jumped on me on a straight road was a few years ago and the last accident I avoided was like never. There are so many FWD cars that do just fine in bad weather or unfavorable circumstances, reality is that no AWD system can compensate for bad driver judgement. It's always nice to have AWD system in your car (but it's not a necessity for 90% of drivers out there) but it won't compensate for anyones incompetent driving skills.
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Replying to: blitzkrieg79 (May 15, 2008 12:27 pm) Sorry, a bit different sounds like an excuse. Either AWD is integral to the vehicle or it's not. Mitsubishi cars to show that when its all said and done Mitsubishis best AWD systems are superior to Subarus But Mitsubishis best is not on the Outlander. So what? ATTESA (Nissan), SH-AWD Yes, and the STI will kick butts for these systems on road and gravel. In practice the STI has a better AWD in bad weather, snow than SH-AWD and probably ATTESA. I am not saying that Subaru makes bad AWD systems, I am just saying they are not as advanced as the mentioned competition. So before you will criticize Outlanders unknown AWD Accelerator pedal position?...enough said. I am not saying that Subaru makes bad AWD systems, I am just saying they are not as advanced as the mentioned competition. The STI has the best all-around system for all types of surfaces and weather. The STI will obliterate any SH-AWD based system on rallye trails. More sophisticated does not make it better.
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Replying to: blitzkrieg79 (May 15, 2008 12:27 pm) Well, "1%" drive on twisty, hilly roads in ME, NH, VT, MA, NY, PA, VA, NC, SC, TN, UT, CO, MN, AZ, CA, NV, OR, WA, AK, ... Do the other 99% drive in Iowa, Nebraska, and Kansas?
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