Edmunds.com | Inside Line | Auto Observer Your Account | Help | Directory
You are here:
![[F]](http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/townhall/webxicons/site.gif){kind=small}
Forums
Coupes & Convertibles Nissan GT-R Article Comments - 2009 Nissan GT-R vs. 2008 Porsche 911 Turbo
990 messages, Last post on Sep 05, 2009 at 6:04 AM
You are in the Nissan GT-R Forum. Your Host is claires
2009 Nissan GT-R vs. 2008 Porsche 911 Turbo - Balance and body control of the GT-R are extraordinary through faster, bumpy bends that will have the 911 unsettled enough to make the driver lose confidence. I had a number of heart-in-mouth moments in the Turbo trying to keep up with the GT-R, even with the Porsche's suspension set to its harder Sport setting. (more)
|
|
|---|---|
|
Replying to: 911nut (Apr 09, 2008 9:17 am) Just the opposite of what you said is true. We are not jealous of Porsche owners, and we really don't care what they think. It used to be true that Porsche and Ferrari had something that could not be replicated, but that is no longer true. Therefore, there just isn't that much to leave us wanting. There is only denial on your side. You still think that everybody wants a Porsche, that you have something that everyone else craves. That these people are 'settling' for the GT-R because they can't afford the magnificent heritage markup on a 911's sticker. Not true at all. I look at those who obsess over Porsche in the same light as those who argue "Ferd vs. Chavy" with the associated window sticker youth urinating on the other's symbol. They all think there is something special about a Ford/Chevy truck that the rest of us don't understand. I think brand loyalty is childish. Like arguing who's Transformer toy is better for reasons even they cannot explain in any detail, because it is all subjective. 911, GT-R, F430, Z06. 4 tools to accomplish the exact same task in slightly different ways. There is nothing inherently special about any of them. There is no IQ difference, no marketing issue, no age boundaries that actually matter in this conversation. If each company swapped factories and it was the Porsche Z06, the Nissan 911, the Chevy F430 and the Ferrari GT-R... we would be having the exact same argument because some people can't get past the badge on the hood. |
|
Guys, i hope you both enjoy your imaginary cars but I think I have said enough on this topic: hence, I must leave you because my biggest dilemma is which one of my Porsches I driving this evening.
|
|
|
|
|
Replying to: 911nut (Apr 09, 2008 4:12 pm) First, the Group A racing record was set in a "996 GT2 Turbo 4WD" by Alzen Motorsports. http://www.answers.com/topic/uwe-alzen In the 24 Hours Nürburgring in their privately built Porsche 996 GT2 Turbo 4WD from 2003 to 2005. Uwe Alzen set the lap record there with this Turbo at 8:09 That 8:09 was for the entire Nurburgring. They covered the Nordschleife section in and estimated 6:40. They also have an official 7:04 Nordschliefe lap time in the 996 GT2 Turbo 4WD. Granted, this is a tubbed out racecar, but it is certainly not laden by the AWD system. An extra 35 kilos is a small price to pay for a tremendous traction advantage, especially while cornering hard at high speeds. I stand by my theory that if Porsche added a well-tuned AWD system to the GT2, it would have a minimal weight gain, and a tremendous performance increase. Thus brings us to the V-spec: It has been confirmed that Nissan is planning to introduce a lighter and more powerful GT-R called the GT-R V-Spec... Nissan has said that this model will be available in the United States in 2010 and will have 550 hp (410 kW) (an increase of 77 hp (57 kW)). It will also be 150 kg (330 lb) lighter and come with carbon ceramic brakes. With these performance figures Nissan hopes to break the Nürburgring lap record for a stock vehicle. According to Car Magazine at the Nurburgring, the GT-R V-Spec lapped the ring at an astounding 7:25 time. This is faster than the Porsche Carrera GT's 7:28 and Pagani Zonda F Clubsport's 7:27.82. Also the GT2's 7:31 on racing slicks, I might add. So in 2009, the infallible GT2 is up for a year's worth of comparison tests against the GT-R V-spec. If these go the same way as the GT-R vs. GT3 tests, the results will be very one-sided. So all the engineering and experience conjecture about AWD having only unwanted side effects? Rubbish. This is a car forum. I had thought it was for the purpose of comparing vehicles. If people come here just to brag (or lie for all we know) about the car that they own, how much money they make, or their IQ, they could probably do that off-site and spare the rest of us.
|
|
|
Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Apr 10, 2008 8:18 am) i've been reading a bit about the GT-R V-Spec and it just sound amazing. I'll be interested to see the price range and the power that thing puts out. The rest of your post is also well said. Let's discuss the cars, not what i can afford to drive vs. what you can afford to drive, and how smart or not smart that makes any of us. I drive a 2003 Nissan SE-R Spec V in sunburst yellow by the way. my first car was a 1992 Nissan Maxima SE in pearl white. Not a porsche by any means, but fun cars in their own right. -thene 
|
|
|
|
|
Replying to: thenebean (Apr 10, 2008 9:50 am) At first I thought it was just a rumor. That there was no way that Nissan would outstrip themselves so early. But here it is, further proof that many of the best handling cars in the future will make use of a well-tuned AWD system. I hope it follows the Corvette bargain-supercar example, with the GT-R being priced just below the Z06, and the V-spec right around ZR1 area. I also hope the carbon-fiber body was enough of a weight savings so they did not have to gut the interior. Another interesting tidbit - the GT-R GT500 that Nissan uses for the SuperGT series in Japan... is actually RWD. So it is very interesting how the fastest Group A car ever built from a 996 Porsche was 4WD and the fastest SuperGT Nissan is RWD. Which is faster? Hard to say, they don't compete in the same events. But my money would have been on the uber-impressive GT2 4WD. I hope you do enjoy your cars. My only Nissan has been a Nismo Frontier pickup. Subjectively its pretty spartan, but because of that fact it objectively does what a light truck is supposed to do better than any other I've owned. Where my family is from, most everyone has a truck/SUV, an Audi or a Subaru. I've dabbled in each, but it MUST have 4WD/AWD  I've long known what the advantages are of AWD on a well-paved mountain road that is damp 200+ days a year. AWD fast becoming the #1 performance improvement couldn't make me happier.
|
|
|
Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Apr 10, 2008 11:37 am) my hubby's car is a Saabaru 9-2x Aero. we wanted a small sport hatch with AWD (helpful in new england) that was fun to drive, and had a little bit of cargo space (thus the hatch). we definitely like it, and the saab version was cheaper to find 1 year used than the Subaru WRX variation. I like to enjoy my trip from point a to point b, as opposed to just getting there. i don't have the money now to enjoy it in a higher end car, but i'll pick something fun in my price range. and my car may not perform like a porsche, but i'm still passionate about it! and it has become apparent (especially with this AWD GT-R) that awd is definitely a plus for a high performance car, even with the additional weight. you've made a very good point on that. -thene
|
|
|
|
|
Replying to: thenebean (Apr 10, 2008 11:56 am) Yup. Its hard to argue that the V-spec handles in spite of its AWD. I think any logical person would conclude that it hanldes because of its AWD. It just opens up new doors on performance. We really haven't tapped that resource fully yet, but the formula has been cracked. I think it will be increasingly challenging for RWD cars to improve on cornering ability without tremendous downforce. Has your husband taken a wrench to the Saabaru at all? It may not be a Porsche, but it can get pretty close. If he ever gets bored with the performance and hasn't done so already, the sky is the limit on that car.
|
|
|
Replying to: bigmclargehuge (Apr 10, 2008 8:18 am) The "rest of us" being "you" - who feel compelled to use this forum multiple times a day to simply regurgitate what you've read without ever actually DRIVING ANYTHING to add a real world pespective? You are certainly free to continue to fill this forum with fantasies of a non-existent GTR Spec V beating a 911 GT2 by from 0-60 or by 0.5% at Nurburgring. Fine. But at least stop thinking that most Porsche, Ferrari or serious sports car buyers base their entire purchase decision on such simple minded definitions of performance. Most serious enthusaists who can spend $100k+/- on a sports car want something that not only performs well for the 2% of the miles that it may spend at a track, but the other 98% of the time it is on public roads. Virtually all of the enthusaists I know are more than happy to give up a couple of tenths of a second advantage that Porsches Tiptronic with "launch control" gives them in a stop light drag race in order to have a ultra crisp short throw 6 speed that gives them 100% control the rest of the time. They outgrew auditioning for the fast and furious movie set long ago. I'm not rushing to judgement against the GT-R because it weighs damn near as much as a SL55 or BMW 6-series GT. But for those who want to theorize that weight is not important because of what they have read, I respectfully suggest you get off your throne and, just for the fun of it, drive the 350Z and S2000/Boxster back to back. According to the holy triumvirate of performance numbers, they are all nearly equal. Yet no serious enthusiast with warm blood running through his/her veins would pick the 350Z over the other two, even if it was given away for free. I know real world experience can be a slap in the face to those who have figured out everything they need to know without the inconveninece of (or respect for) experience. Two of my business school classmates were at opposite ends of the "stock market efficiency" theory 20+ years ago. The theorist that is now a well respected professor. The realist now has his name on the outside of the business school, having donated $50 million+ of his hedge fund earnings to the university.
|
|
|
|
|
Replying to: habitat1 (Apr 11, 2008 3:27 am) And by nonexistent V-spec, you mean this car? http://www.autoblog.com/2008/04/08/nissan-gt-r-v-spec-lap-times-stun-observers/ There is way too much bias for you to call yourself a realist. Your theories sound something like "I've driven a Porsche, therefore Porsche is best". I would just as soon take "I've driven a PT Cruiser, therefore a PT Cruiser is best" as realism. For as long as your experience draws you to a predetermined conclusion, it accounts for nothing. You can twist it anyway you like. Do you really think I'm going to take your word for it? Not likely. FYI, I put my brother-in-law's Carrera 2 through its paces. It was ok, nothing special. My father offered me his Boxter as a college graduation present. He was so offended when I asked if I could sell the rubbish vehicle and buy something else that he renigged on the whole deal. Why don't I think my experiences are valid arguments? Because they aren't. They are opinion-based and anyone else in the same situation might come to a different conclusion. Indeed, let us stick to something that can be verified. Besides, the GT-R beating the 911 is REAL. It happened and it is everywhere you look. It was the Porsche fanbois that started with: I drive Porsche because I have a higher IQ, Everyone wants a Porsche but some can only afford a Nissan, Nissan only markets to poor people And about a dozen more excuses why Porsche is subjectively better. And you are defending those as realistic? You are when you chastise me for asking that we get back on topic. Please, settle down and post something we can have a discussion on.
|
|
You are here:
Forums
Coupes & Convertibles Nissan GT-R Article Comments - 2009 Nissan GT-R vs. 2008 Porsche 911 Turbo
New? Join Now!
Forum Tools
Search Forums
Browse by Vehicle
2010 Nissan GT-R
2010 Porsche 911
Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
Today's Chats
