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Coupes & Convertibles Nissan GT-R Article Comments - 2009 Nissan GT-R vs. 2008 Porsche 911 Turbo
990 messages, Last post on Sep 05, 2009 at 6:04 AM
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2009 Nissan GT-R vs. 2008 Porsche 911 Turbo - Balance and body control of the GT-R are extraordinary through faster, bumpy bends that will have the 911 unsettled enough to make the driver lose confidence. I had a number of heart-in-mouth moments in the Turbo trying to keep up with the GT-R, even with the Porsche's suspension set to its harder Sport setting. (more)
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Replying to: 240ka (Jan 20, 2008 12:12 pm) The attributes I was referring to were "nimbleness" and "precision". Let's start with a test. Drive a Honda S2000, 350Z and Porsche Boxster back to bask. If you can't tell which one weighs 450 lbs more than the other two and think that the 350Z is just as tight, nimble and precise as the other two, we can indeed end this discussion now. Or, if you want to save time, drive your G35 back to back with a 335i. If you think the G35 is as refined and precise in it's handling and driving dynamics, we can again end the discussion. That's not to say the G35 isn't a decent car and a decent value. But if driving dynamics are your highest priority, the BMW is clearly superior. I think you are also guilty of getting more than a bit carried away in embelishing the facts. The GT-R has supposedly run a 2 second faster Nurburgring time than the 911 Turbo. The GT3 is faster than the Turbo. The GT2 is 9 seconds faster than the Turbo and 7 seconds faster than the GT-R. Again, though, none of this matters much to me. Nor would I go out and buy a SL65 to boast that I had 600+ horsepower and 738 ft-lbs of torque. That car can absolutely obliterate any of the ones we are talking about in a 50 to 150 acceleration test. Which is nice to know, but does not a sports car make. in reference to the GT-R's weight. the weight is one of the main factors for its superb handling. I'm not sure what physics course you took, if any, but weight (mass) is an enemy to changing directions quickly. I didn't make that up - Newton made that a "law". Sure, you can slap bigger tires on a car and stiffen up the suspension, but I would still prefer to see the engineers do a better of a job keeping it down in the first place. I sure as hell hope you aren't suggesting that a 3,400 lb GT-R would not perform even better than a 3,900 lb one? I have never heard a single explanation as to why a "sports car" needs to weigh 900 lbs more than my 1995 Maxima. And, for the last time, this is the company that promised us a reincarnation of the spirit of the 240Z with the 350Z and then actually gave us a bloated pig compared to the S2000.
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Replying to: habitat1 (Jan 20, 2008 2:15 pm) i know that a G35 first shouldnt be compared to a 335i, the G35 comparision goes with the 330 but not a 335i. the G35 and 335 if offer to differnet things. the G35 gives you more a a raw sports car feel than that off a 335i. which is why the 335i feels better and is more refined and poitn blank the G35 isnt on the 335i's level like the G35 isnt on the G37's level if i wanted to make a comparison to the 335i it would have been the G37. no where in my arguement did i say a stock GT-R of 3800lbs would handle better than a GT-R thats had a weight reduction of about 400lbs bringing it to 3400lbs. nor would i say that. so again. dont get things out of my arugment im not saying. you are trying to argue a point thats has nothing to do with anything. your 3800lbs GT-R vs 3400lbs GT-R comparision has nothing to do with why the GT-R out handles the 911 turbo. the 3494lbs 911 turbo doesnt handle like 3800lbs GT-R and it most definitely wouldnt handle like a 3400lbs GT-R so that comparision is utterly pointless but on the other hand. this is not about a 3800lbs GT-R vs a 3400lbs GT-R so thats not even the same arguement. things defy physics quite a bit. and the GT-R is a testament to that. b/c a 3800lbs GT-R outhandles a 3494lbs 911 turbo. because of the way the GT-R is built. and like i said, if you believe these reviews are lying and favoring the Nissan GT-R over the beloved 911 turbo which people have been baised to for over 40 years and for good reason then somethings wrong with you. the fact is is that people are shocked and upset that NIssan has been able to knock the 911 off its throne so early when people thought either it would never happen or not this soon. thats your problem you are still in denial abou that. but its a new day. things change and you have to be willing to accept that. change is good. and lik ei said. if the 911 turbo is going to remain 120k then porsche is going to have redo it in order to justify its price. b/c the GT-R has shown that better than 911 performance and quality should only cost 70k the G37 rivals the 335i and the GT-R kills the 911 turbo so the fact that yall keep wanting to harp on the weight is the very reason why you need to drop it. b/c Nissan has built the GT-R in a way that 3800lbs GT-R out handles a 3494lbs 911. review after review says it. so they must have all gotten together, and conspired to dethrone porsche right? you act like theres some type of conspiracy going on. the fact is that the GT-R is much better than the 911turbo. well actaully what nissan as manage to do is show that while the 911 turbo is a great car its not that great and again comprehend what you read. 240KA refer to the 240sx and the KA24de motor that comes with it. not the 240Z. so im not talking about the 240Z and while the 350z is bloated it still out performs the S2k and boxster even though i dont give a damn about either of the three. if i cared about the 350z i would have gotten it over the G35. but they both offer something different. the 350z has better performance and handling over the G35 but the G looks better, looks sportier and is practical. and with a few upgrade 350z perfamance isnt far from the G35's grasp. but again this isnt about the G35, 350z, 240z or BMW's. this is about the GT-R vs the 911 so anything outside of that i dnt care to talk about
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Replying to: 240ka (Jan 20, 2008 2:38 pm) For someone who admits to compromising performance by buying a G35 over a 350Z based upon "looks", your excessive enthusiasm for 2 second quicker Nurburgring time for the GT-R is especially hypocritic. I doubt you (or I for that matter) could drive anything around Nurburgring and get within a half minute of either time. And if looks are important to you, then I would have thought the GT-R's Mattel Toy inspired exterior and Game Boy inspired plastic interior would be more than enough to keep you at bay. At least with the NSX, Acura engineers understood that you not only need to compete in performance, but also in style. The NSX looks like it belongs in the same garage as a 911 and 430. The GT-R looks like it would be more at home with a Trans Am and Mustang GT or maybe a Viper on a good day. This sounds like I'm being more negative on the GT-R than I intend. Nobody I know personally has driven it yet. Notwithstanding my concerns over a 3,900 lb curb weight, I will give the GT-R a fair shake when it comes to a test drive. In the meantime, perhaps you should add a little more variety to your bathroom periodical rack.
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Replying to: habitat1 (Jan 21, 2008 2:45 am) the the 350z and G35 are for different purposes. so again i wont entertain that. that 911 turbo being beat by 2 secs is a big margin. i dont know what world you live in. and you are starting to sound like a porsche fanboy. b/c you seem to be in denial also fact of the matter is that a 3800lbs outperforms a 3500lbs 911 turbo and not by a small margin either. no matter what excuse you come with doesnt change the fact that Nissan made the better car. and the reviews arent only talking numbers. just give it up. your precious little 911 turbo has been exposed not to be that great and should not wear a 120k price tag. point blank, now go cry about it. The GT-R is the new KING
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Replying to: 240ka (Jan 21, 2008 10:30 am) Most of the rest of us here are at least mature enough to keep control of our bodily fluids - and our final opinions - until we actually DRIVE the friggin car. But no, no, not you. You are drooling (or worse) all over your keyboard telling us about how you have read every review written about the GT-R and by god, that must be all there is to it. So that "big" 2 second margin at Nurburgring time means that the 911 Turbo is dead? As I assume is also the Bugatti Veyron, Ferrari 430 and 599, etc? And the GT-R is the new "King" that they will all be turning in their keys to get? Except perhaps those fortunate few who have a 911 GT2 with its super duper humongous 7-second advantage over the GT-R. Frankly, from the sounds of it, the $70k price tag for the GT-R would be a horrific waste of about $69,997 on you. I can't imagine you could get any more excited by actually owning and driving a high performance vehicle than you already are from just reading about it in a $3 magazine. Do you actually intend to buy one when they become available? Or just find something else to fantasize over?
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Replying to: habitat1 (Jan 21, 2008 11:58 am) Amen - and, by the way, not something that will be happening soon. I was at a business reception and the owner of one of the local Nissan franchises was there. Turns out, he has to pay an additional franchise fee to carry the GT-R, equip his service area with a different lift to service the GT-R and send a team of several technicians at his expense to get the specialized training. Nissan is encouraging him to do this, by suggesting that he should be able to get at least $20k over MSRP for the first year or two. However, they aren't promising him more than 3-4 cars per year. This multi-dealership owner, by the way, drives a Ferrari 360 (which is a brand he does not sell) When I jokingly asked if he would be trading in his keys for a GT-R he only laughed. He hasn't even fully committed to carrying it, saying off the record that he thinks Nissan's idea of encouraging dealers to charge additional mark-ups to make it worth their while is "embarassingly bush league". He had to wait 2+ years to get his 360, but when he did, he paid exactly MSRP for it, as mandated by Ferrari, USA. It appears Nissan has a way to go in knowing how to treat customers that can afford $70-100k+ sports cars.
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Replying to: spiritinthesky (Jan 21, 2008 12:56 pm) I'm really surprised to hear this. I was under the impression that Nissan discouraged dealers from marking up over MSRP. To hear from the owner that they are encouraging it is amazing. I seriously don't think you'll see a bunch of dealers carrying them. I know the store that I used to work at won't. You could barely get our owner to buy a new pane of glass let alone spend additional money on techs. The profit margin on these vehicles just isn't that huge unless marked up over sticker. Let's do a quick cost breakdown. Profit in a $70k automobile? Probably around $11k. Cost to train techs, get certified and get new equipment? I dunno, how about $75k. If they sell 2 GT-R's a year and sell at sticker.... that's only around $22k. Sell for $20k over? You would need a couple of years to break even. Granted, having a GT-R on the lot would certainly pull traffic through the door, but those vehicles won't even get to the showroom. 240 will be sitting on the steps with clammy hands and butterflies in his stomach waiting for his new ride to be unloaded from the truck!  -moo |
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Replying to: chrmdome (Jan 17, 2008 5:45 pm) Why not something like the GT3 or Z06? I dunno.
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Replying to: pmc4 (Jan 21, 2008 3:36 pm) second why would they compare it to the Z06 if its better than the 911 and the 911 is better than the z06. and the GT_R detroys the M3. while they are in the samebut price range. the M3 isnt a competitor to the GT-R. the GT-R's competitor is the 911turbo and up nothing lower. like the M3, or z06 |
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