Article Comments - Comparison Test: 2007-2008 Sport Sedans

475 messages, Last post on Jul 25, 2008 at 4:41 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Cadillac CTS, BMW 3 Series, Infiniti G35, Mercedes-Benz 350-Class, Mercedes-Benz C-Class, Car Comparisons, Sedan

Comparison Test: 2007-2008 Sport Sedans - This is exactly why we gathered this group of sport sedans. That is, to find out if the 2008 Cadillac CTS, 2007 Infiniti G35 Sport, 2008 Lexus IS 350 or 2008 Mercedes-Benz C350 Sport can topple the Bavarian champ — the 2007 BMW 335i. In the spirit of the segment, each car in the test is outfitted with sport package hardware — usually a stiffer suspension and bigger wheels and tires — and an automatic transmission. (more)

Outline

Messages Page 12 of 49: 1; ...; 9; 10; 11; 12; 13; 14; 15; ...; 49; Prev; Next; Last

#104 of 475 Re: Where is the TL typeS ???????? [habitat1] by graphicguy Nov 10, 2007 (8:01 am)
Replying to: habitat1 (Nov 10, 2007 5:33 am) habitat....good post. The TL is a very nice car. I used to own one and actually liked it quite a bit. But, as you point out, it is FWD (albeit probably the best of the FWD breed), and has those inherent limitations. Trying to make a point about any superiority a TL may have when compared to a 335i (or even my 330i), you better not put acceleration or handling into the equation. Using the S2000 as a benchmark to compare the TL to is just silly. Now, if you want to compare feature content, value, resale (although even here, BMW can make a strong case), you'd have a valid basis of comparison. A couple of months ago, I had a neighbor trade in her '07 G35 for an '08 TL-S. To me, that wasn't very smart. But, the deal she got on the TL-S ($500 over invoice), and the interior of the TL (over the G) is what made her swap. That said, she's never going to touch the performance potential of either car. So, to her, it made sense....for the TL's wheels, seats, styling all the bells and whistles. Both were/are nice cars. She's happier with the TL-S. To each their own. Replies to this message: roadburner (Nov 10, 2007 9:16 am)
#105 of 475 Re: Rice Burner ? [dglassm] by kdshapiro Nov 10, 2007 (8:48 am)
Replying to: dglassm (Nov 10, 2007 6:51 am) I guess it depends if you want a car that drives or a car that sits in the dealership waiting for back ordered run flat tires and or fuel pumps that do not work ... Give me a "brake", have you been to the G35 maintenance and repair board. All of these models are recommended by CR, so I'm not sure of what you are alluding to. In addition the 3 series styling has way more character then the G35. If you want the best RWD entry level sedan, it's the 335 period. You can settle for second best and get the G.
#106 of 475 Re: Rice Burner ? [dglassm] by circlew Nov 10, 2007 (8:51 am)
Replying to: dglassm (Nov 10, 2007 6:51 am) Here is my answer based on experience with my 330xi...the dealer experience was phenomenal and the loaners sufficed for every dealer service event tithe a 528i, 335i and 330i to keep me going at no extra cost. That's why I would pay the extra money for the BMW 3'er on top of the fact is is a world class leader in it's vehicle segment. I get my value on many things other than money savings. When it's your time to experience a higher level, you balance it with extra "dinero". Regards, OW
#108 of 475 Re: Where is the TL typeS ???????? [graphicguy] by roadburner Nov 10, 2007 (9:16 am)
Replying to: graphicguy (Nov 10, 2007 8:01 am) Both were/are nice cars. She's happier with the TL-S. To each their own. Sounds like the TL is a car that is better to wear than it is to drive...
#109 of 475 Re: Where is the TL typeS ???????? [habitat1] by circlew Nov 10, 2007 (9:32 am)
Replying to: habitat1 (Nov 10, 2007 5:33 am) Thanks, Teach, for another accurate lesson. That is how you drive and is my reasoning for a commute-o-bile with AWD and slush to the max and an S2000 or variant for the Laguna weekends when you just need to hang it out the old fashioned way in the proper instrument of choice.. Here is another tech Honda is working on to make sure it competes at ever more scalpel-like levels: As weight and direct power is shifted to the 4 corners, the experience will no doubt be even more exhilarating given the suspension tuning of, say an S2000 with approximately 400-600 HP. Regards, OW Replies to this message: pmc4 (Nov 11, 2007 6:41 pm) kdshapiro (Nov 11, 2007 6:50 pm) pmc4 (Nov 13, 2007 9:31 pm) and 5 more... spiritinthesky (Nov 12, 2007 5:29 am) circlew (Nov 12, 2007 5:49 am) threxx (Nov 12, 2007 8:01 am)
#110 of 475 Well, . . . by cdnpinhead Nov 10, 2007 (12:35 pm)
the more I watch the BMW/Infiniti "my dad can beat your dad" follies, the less interested I become. If the Infiniti person has been driving for more than a few years (ie: the G35 is the first real car they've ever driven) & can discuss something beyond what can be read in magazines, I pay much more attention. Somehow, I pay less attention these days. There are well thought out Inifiniti posts (thanks to Scott) & there are most of the rest. The follies will, I'm sure, continue. Party on!
#111 of 475 IMO by sjaieve Nov 10, 2007 (1:03 pm)
Although the results are not what I expected, I would have been happier with this ranking: 1-Lex 2-G 3-3 series 4- C 5 - CTS Here are my reasons CTS should be last, my reason is based on the fact that this is an American car, based on the fact that most of the American Car manufacturers are in turmoil right now due to their fuel guzzlers, unreliable cars, I would no want to own a +40k version of these problems. For example, the CTS has +300hp and a 3.6 litre engine, the G, 3 & IS350 have a 3.5 litre engines and are similarly powered. The word that comes to mind there is "inefficiency" on the part of the CTS. I understand the CTS is bigger, but the 5 series would still beat it from 0-60, even the GS350 AWD would outpace this car. C-Class. 268hp for a +30k car, this car was launched after everything else on this list, & Mercedes still could not do better than the competition. The interior is not so great and given the lack of reliability of the model it replaces, I would not spend my hard earned money on this car. Currently I drive an IS250, yes, go ahead and laugh, I would never consider buying a model slower than the competition. For this reason, the CTS & C-Class are a BIG no no The 3 series is a great car, I do not have anything against it, I dont thnk it looks great, but this is my opinion and its no big deal. However, I find it dificult to justify the premium one has to pay for this car over the competition. The only reason I think it costs more, is because the Lex and Infiniti have better economies of scale over the BMW since the cars share parts with Toyota & Nissan. There is nothing wrong with sharing parts since Toyota and Nissan make good cars anyway. When the editors concluded that the G is a better bang for the buck over the 3, I believe they got it wrong a bit there. The G is better bang for the buck over the Lex, but the BMW is overpriced, thats the bottom line The G is a great car, better bang for the buck, loaded with technology, costs around 5k less than the IS350 (fully loaded). I love technology, the more a car has the better IMO. Now I will zero in on this price difference. I test drove both cars recently, I think its a known fact the IS comes with more tech than the G in addition the fit and finish on the Lex is better than the G. The G has good fit & finish and the Lex takes it a notch or 2 higher. That makes me appreciate why the Lex costs more. In addition, the Lex is faster than the G. For this reason, I rank the IS higher. Replies to this message: pmc4 (Nov 10, 2007 2:42 pm) circlew (Nov 10, 2007 6:07 pm) pmc4 (Nov 11, 2007 6:01 pm) and 13 more...
#112 of 475 Re: My comments on the test... [sevenfeet0] by pmc4 Nov 10, 2007 (2:26 pm)
Replying to: sevenfeet0 (Nov 07, 2007 12:14 pm) I can't see how you think the BMW wins that comparison. I mean, to see what the 3-Series really is, just go to Europe, where it's made. What are they in Europe? Are they luxury sedans? Sports sedans? Nope and nope; they're... You guessed it... TAXI'S! In fact, the only difference between the Euro-spec BMW and the US-spec BMW is the options list. The Euro-spec BMW 3-Series comes standard with a tachometer, fuel gauge, automatic transmission, vinyl-padded interior surfaces and an engine with six cylinders. American-spec BMW 3-Series adds leather, i-drive, and about $25,000 to the sticker price. The Cadillac and Infiniti on the other hand are purpose-built, true luxury/sport sedans that are well worth the $$$ printed on the window sticker: They're roomy, comfortable, leather-lined (the BMW uses vinyl padding-not leather. Think 1970's naugahyde sofa) cruisers with the world's most advanced powertrains and chassis'. Here's the interior of the 335i, clearly showing it's taxi heritage: No unison between the i-drive knob (AIWA boom-box inspired), lights on/off knob to the left of steering (black and Radio Shack inspired) looks almost glued on as an afterthought, and the A/C control knobs (automobile interior inspired). The black plastic that frames the CD player looks so flimsy you can burn a cigarette hole through it, the plastic that frames the gear shifter appears as if it's from a different model car altogether, almost all control buttons are so tiny they demand the use of a magnafying glass to discern them, shapes and forms that divide rather than unify (hard plastics divide from the singular soft plastic cowl, gentle curves here; sharp angles there, a glued-on speaker grille in the door panel [but at least it's the same color as the door panel], a fatal interruption at the base of the center console where it's supposed to join the transmission tunnel, e.t.c. Just horrible execution altogether. Here's the truly winning interior: Words aren't necessary here... impeccable fit and finish, transitions between one panel to the next, consisiency between all surfaces, levels of quality that belong in a vehicle that costs twice as much, e.t.c. ...No taxi heritage here, folks; only that of an exemplary and unparalleled sports/luxury sedan. You can buy the BMW and Edmunds can revel in value all they want. In closing, however, the Cadillac is the best sedan here if we ignore sticker prices... Replies to this message: sweendogy (Nov 10, 2007 2:52 pm) kdshapiro (Nov 11, 2007 7:35 am) pmc4 (Nov 11, 2007 5:43 pm) roadburner (Nov 11, 2007 6:03 pm) kdshapiro (Nov 11, 2007 6:27 pm) and 4 more...
#113 of 475 Re: IMO [sjaieve] by pmc4 Nov 10, 2007 (2:42 pm)
Replying to: sjaieve (Nov 10, 2007 1:03 pm) "CTS should be last, my reason is based on the fact that this is an American car, based on the fact that most of the American Car manufacturers are in turmoil right now due to their fuel guzzlers, unreliable cars" As it currently stands, General Motors is now poised to dethrone Toyota as the leader in fuel-saving vehicles. Toyota has the Prius, but it uses a first-generation parallel-hybrid setup and they have no intention of bringing a second-generation Prius to the market anytime soon outside of going with Li-on batteries; GM's second-generation series-hybrid setup will get the same city mileage from the Cadillac Escalade as Toyota is getting from their Camry. Let's not forget that Toyota is just in the business to make money not save the environment which is why there's no innovation nowadays; they made a first-generation hybrid powertrain in 1997 then called it quits. GM, on the other hand is getting ready to launch the Chevrolet Volt, which will truly revolutionize the emmissions landscape. Where's toyota to answer to the Chevrolet Volt? Making money hand-over-fist selling an antiquidated parallel-hybrid drivetrain in the Prius which was being sold last century, that's where. Where's GM? Here: The Escalade hybrid will get a forecasted 22 MPG city. That's the same gas mileage as this little gas miser from Toyota, the Corporate Criminals: The GM behemoth will get the same MPG as the little Toyota. This alone tells me that GM is on the verge of revoltionising the industry in the near future. The Escalade and Tahoe hybrids, and the Volt (not to mention the Saturn and Chevy hybrids) supports this assumption. Replies to this message: circlew (Nov 10, 2007 6:07 pm) pmc4 (Nov 11, 2007 6:01 pm) circlew (Nov 12, 2007 4:20 am) and 11 more...