Edmunds.com | Inside Line | Auto Observer Your Account | Help | Directory
You are here:
![[F]](http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/townhall/webxicons/site.gif){kind=small}
Forums
Automotive News & Views GM News, New Models and Market Share
8360 messages, Last post on Nov 24, 2009 at 5:12 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
|
Let me give you a little comparison. Hyundai, 10 years ago sold cheap cars with below par quality. Started off low as the bottom feeder. They constantly put up huuuge effort to raise their quality. Result: now they have decent quality cars, improved customer service, and increasing popularity. This is the success they've earned. All this from a company which started roughly only 3 decades ago, now the 5th largest car company in the world. Then we have the 100 year old GM. 10 years ago selling not so cheap cars with similar below par quality. Barely put any effort at all over the years until just recently. Alas, most the effort they did revolved around perceived "patriotism", cost cutting, lies and propagandas. What we get now, pretty much the same old GM we saw 10 years ago. 90% crappy cars, 9% decent, 1% world class. Customer service, improved meagerly, popularity? well the annual drop in market share shows everything. Result? Same old GM that can't survive without begging taxpayers for money. A century worth of experience got beaten up by Hyundai's measly 20 years experience. See the difference? You call that deserving anything? GM's service didn't improve much to the level it became on par with Toyota, it's because Toyota's falling service quality that allowed GM to catch up. Compare it with Honda for better comparison, which still maintain it's stellar customer service. Why do people always pick the easier preys? You'll never lead that way. If there's any car company in US that deserve more than it gets right now, it's Hyundai, not GM. |
|
|
|
|
Replying to: gagrice (Jan 12, 2009 5:52 am) That's not good business, but that would fit with what our friend has met with the local Toyota dealer with no competition for 80 miles north and east and 20 miles south and 30 miles to the west; they do as they please because people feel they _have_ to buy a Toyota and many people won't travel that far to shop. On the other hand there are 6-7 Chev dealers within a 20-mile radius of the Chev dealer next to the Toyo deal. >GM should consider that. My last GMC was serviced free by the dealer That's a Five Star idea for GM. It would allow selling at a high price for value added. With the 100K miles powertrain warranty that really adds to the value. I recall in the 80s and 90s that people who bought certain foreign brands were told they had to get the cars service at the dealer or else the car would "blow up." And they wouldn't honor the warranty because the car hadn't been there for the oil changes and lubes and other fixes. I knew people who were scared to not get their car serviced at the dealer. On the other hand people with Chevies expected to just have the local garage change the oil when they remembered at 7500 miles, e.g. In that period 4000 was a long oil change interval for the oils and the engines of the era. I recall someone who worked for me who had a Chev that wore a cam lobe. The oil had been changed at 7500 miles + intervals. You could see the wear on the lifters. |
|
|
Nearly three-quarters of car shoppers prefer to buy American-made products, according to a survey by Kelley Blue Book. More than half say they try to buy American-made products if the price is competitive, and 14% say they will go out of their way to buy American. Six percent say they will only buy American-made products and they will do without if an American-made product is not available. Let's look at the keywords here: "more than half will buy American if the price is competitive", GM's pricing is not exactly competitive, it's competitive so far because of the healthy discounts. The real keyword is IF, if GM needs profit, discounts must be lifted, when that happens price will be much less competitive. The next keywords: "American-made". Honda Accord is American made in Ohio. If you insist that American made means domestic brand, remember that Ford is American, and it has the more public trust and confidence than GM-Chrysler. "Seeing the domestic automakers' recent struggle has ignited a heightened sense of patriotism among some American car shoppers, and the latest Kelley Blue Book Marketing Research indicates that people are pulling for the Big Three to survive and thrive," said Jack R. Nerad, executive editorial director and executive market analyst for Kelley Blue Book and kbb.com. Will they keep their words and buy domestic? We shall once again see if the sense of patriotism will prevail over the sense of logic and reality. History has shown that logic wins most (if not all) of the time. I'll be patient and wait for the results. 
|
|
|
|
|
Replying to: m4d_cow (Jan 12, 2009 6:34 am) We'll check on Hyundai when they're 100 years old. I'm not sure what 100 years has to do with anything here, but I'll play the silly number game on years. I disagree with the tenet that in 1998 GM was selling below par quality. The propagandists would have you believe that, but last I recall Honda had transmission problems and Toyota had sludge in that period. >still maintain (sic) it's (sic) stellar customer service. Hmmm. Check in on the Odyssey and VCM discussions re customer service. The higher profit per vehicle the foreign companies enjoy due to their having come to the automotive party late without any legacy costs of older employees allows them a built-in warranty so they replace transmissions up to 100k free and have built up some customer resentment over their handling of seamless VCM action and vibration. Our neighbor across the street is on his 8th Honda product (all Acuras) and they have never seen a dealer service box. He uses an independent HonAc service store--he avoids that stellar customer service current owners are getting). As for GM having poor quality, I would determine it was greatly improved in 1989 and has continued up from there. And I've owned the products, properly serviced them, and they have served me well. So it's time to break the chain of negativity passed on because it's chic to say negative things about all GMs. If you had a particular model that failed you, whether it is because of poor build or your failure to properly service the car,, I feel sorry for your problems, but don't ascribe your experience to all GMs. People owning HoToys started having more problems in 03 as their quality regressed to the mean. |
|
|
Replying to: imidazol97 (Jan 12, 2009 7:00 am) You totally missed the point, what I'm saying is with a cenury worth of experience GM should've learned the lesson mush earlier instead of too late like now. We gave them too many chances to improve they get spoiled and lazy. The same with employees, you go too easy on them and they'll bite you back in the butt. As for GM having poor quality, I would determine it was greatly improved in 1989 and has continued up from there. Nope, I believe the quality improved significantly in around 2005. GM before then had too many crappy products that belong in the dumpster, Aztek, Cavalier, Malibu, GrandAm, GrandPrix, Trailblazer (and it's clones), MonteCarlo, just to name a few. Significant improvement compared to past GM, but not significant enough to lead the class. I've owned 2 Hondas so far (98 Civic and 06 Acura TSX). And yes my '98 Civic got that problematic auto back then, but it was immediately recalled and replaced under warranty. Domestics don't do that, and if they do, they usually wait for a serious problem to come up before fixing it.
|
|
|
I admit maybe I wasn't being clear, so here goes. I was impressed not by Honda's quality, but by their customer service. The way they fix things, quick, hassle free, and professionally was, and still is the best as shown with Acura's. Toyota I'm never impressed with, their quality is falling and customer service is below par by my standards, marginal at best. Vette's article shows GM's Chevrolet service is about on par with Toyota, yes I agree. Toyota going down, Gm going up so it's only natural that GM finally caught up. Toyota and Honda have tranny problems, so? GM of that time had even more problems. No product is trouble free, it's "how problematic" and "how the company handles it" that really matter. I've said this earlier, GM has improved in the former part, but the latter GM still needs to work on. Improvement in just one area isn't nowhere near enough to shake off the old image.
|
|
...Mercedes-Benz practically invented the automobile and they were having reliability problems until recently. Studebaker was the oldest vehicle manufacturer in its time. Where are they now?
|
|
|
Replying to: m4d_cow (Jan 12, 2009 6:34 am) GM needs to find it's way...somehow. The new Malibu is proof it can be done! |
|
|
Replying to: imidazol97 (Jan 12, 2009 5:27 am) Oh nonsense. The sludge discussion dragged out 5,500 posts - what more can you add? Sludge still comes up in all the various Toyota discussions around here. And the last I checked the Odyssey transmission problems discussion was still going strong too.
|
|
|
|
|
Replying to: m4d_cow (Jan 12, 2009 6:29 am) Any data? Vette's article shows GM's Chevrolet service is about on par with Toyota, yes I agree I supplied the data? When was this? Can you show me where this was?
|
|
You are here:
Forums
Automotive News & Views GM News, New Models and Market Share
New? Join Now!
Forum Tools
Search Forums
Browse by Vehicle
Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
Today's Chats
