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You are in the Honda Fit
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Honda Fit, Interior, Hatchback
#373 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [kagedude]
Sep 12, 2009 (8:06 am)
2009 Honda Fit DEALER CRAMDOWN, AC blows hot air
I purchased a 2009 Honda Fit Sport approximately one year ago. I live in CA (Central Valley) and have noticed the AC compressor shuts off from a start and blows hot air on the occupants until it reaches a certain RPM level and the compressor turns back on. Living in the Central Valley it is not uncommon to have summer days of 105 degrees plus. The AC in the Fit is weak to begin with and usually has to be run on maximum to cool the vehicle to a minimal or normal level. The dealer was well aware of the problem and told me the car is designed to turn off the air conditioner compressor from a start if 20% or more throttle is used, the compressor will come back on when the engine reaches a certain RPM.
I have had the car in three separate times for this problem and have been advised by the service department that the compressor shuts down if the gas pedal is pressed over 20% from a start. The dealer’s solution to the problem is for the driver to stay under 20% throttle on all starts. This is not practical and would have every car around you honk at you because you’re moving so slow or obstructing traffic. The dealer has taken the company line that the vehicle is performing as designed. That is a true statement, the vehicle is performing as designed but the vehicle has a serious design flaw that they apparently acknowledge but will not fix. Since when is it acceptable for the AC unit to blow hot air on occupants at any point in time? It appears Honda is taking the "Cram Down" approach and expects customers to accept this obvious design flaw. I have never heard of any car which blows hot air on occupants at any point in time. How can Honda deviate so far from the accepted norm / standard of what air conditioning is and think or tell customers it is acceptable?
My expectation is what I would call the standard norm. Once the AC is turned on you expect it to blow cold air, uninterrupted cold air, meaning not intermittently blow hot air on occupants from a stop at 20% or more throttle. How can Honda deviate so far from the accepted norm of what everyone's expectation of AC is and cram their design flaw down customer's throats? How can Honda advise customers "the car is performing as designed and expect the customer to accept that? True, the car is in fact performing as designed but the car has a serious design flaw. Had Honda disclosed their design flaw to me before I purchased the car I would not have bought it. Come to think of it, I cannot think of anyone who would want or accept an air-conditioning unit that intermittently blows hot air on you from each and every stop where 20% or more throttle is used.
The 2009 Honda Accord they rented for me does not blow hot air on me after I accelerate from a stop. Yet the Assistant Service Manager told me it does. I have driven the Accord a few days and I can tell you it does not blow hot air on you from a stop. I wonder why Honda chooses not to put this ingenious Honda Fit idea in their 2009 Accord model or use it for advertising such as: “cutting edge technology, Honda Fit blows hot air on occupants when air conditioner is on”. Perhaps I should try turning on the heater when I want cold air and turning on the air conditioner when I want hot air. I am surprised the dealer has not suggested trying to rotate the tires at every stop to get the air conditioner to work properly. The dealer retreats to the company line that “the vehicle is performing as designed” even though they admit the car is designed to shut off the air conditioner compressor if 20% or more throttle is used from a start. If the compressor is shut off it cannot produce cold air. If it gets the air from outside if the recirculation feature is not on it takes the ambient air (temperature) and blows it on the occupants of the vehicle. If it is 110 degrees outside, the car will blow 110 degree air on you when the compressor is shut off.
Please advise if you are having the same problem and/or any solution. The problem is there is not a solution yet. There is a service bulletin on the issue but it only advised the service department to advise customers "the vehicle is performing as designed". That does not fix the problem; it only further aggravates customers and gives Honda a bad name. It would be nice if Honda would step up to the plate and take ownership of the problem and proceed with the appropriate corrective action instead of advising dealers to inform customers that the vehicle is performing as designed when in fact it has a serious design flaw.
I’m not an auto mechanic but as a lay person my guess is that Honda designed the Fit to be too “Green”. The current engine in the 2009 Honda Fit Sport is not large enough to meet the demands / loads placed on it. I would also assume that Honda is familiar enough with the issue that the decision to have the compressor turn off during 20% or more throttle from a stop is the “best choice” from their alternatives. It makes me wonder what the alternatives are. I would assume that the Fit simply cannot run the current air conditioning unit on maximum full time. If my assumptions are in fact true what more do you need to constitute a Lemon vehicle? The air conditioning does not work as compared to every other car in America. I assume that the air conditioning is not a problem in the 2009 Honda Accord as I have experienced simply because the Accord has a larger engine and is able to meet all demands / loads placed on it with ease.
An additional issue is that the 2009 Fit shocks me every time I get out of the car and close the door. Once again, Honda chooses not to fix the problem rather issue a technical service bulletin which advises customers why this is happening and what type of clothing to wear to avoid the problem (which in my case did not work and is not a fix). Once again, my 2009 Honda Accord rental does not shock me when I get out of the car and close the door.
I guess Honda believes the people with these defective 2009 Fits are small enough that they can effectively ignore the problem and not worry about it. I don't have much faith in the Lemon Law and don't want to spent huge amounts of time pursuing it. Does anyone out there have any answers?
I think it is a pathetic approach Honda is taking towards their customers and it is leaving a bad taste in my mouth about owning a Honda. If there are any prospective Honda Fit buyers out there please pay attention to these issues. Does anyone have any ideas how to get more publicity on the issue? Maybe Honda would address the issue if it appeared in the automotive headlines or front page headlines.
I have documentation i.e. email with dealer acknowledging the problem and advising that there is not a fix to the problem, my registration documenting my Fit ownership, rental car (Honda Accord) registration, etc. documenting my rental, etc.. I would appreciate some
#374 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [rudy33]
Sep 12, 2009 (9:09 am)
There's a fix documented on the FitFreak forum (www.fitfreak.net).
#375 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [stephen987]
Sep 13, 2009 (7:54 am)
What is the fix? I did not see a fix on the site. Perhaps you would be kind enough to post it on this site. The dealer does not have a fix.
#377 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [rudy33]
Sep 30, 2009 (9:46 am)
I'm not sure what you mean by "blowing hot air." If you have the AC on and the vent sent to recirculate inside air, even if the AC compressor turns off for a few seconds during acceleration to save gas, there shouldn't immediatly be "hot air" blowing from the vents but only air that's the same temperature as what's already inside the cabin. Maybe you're bringing in the outside air or have the temperature set to hot??
#378 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [stephen987]
Sep 30, 2009 (12:16 pm)
There is no fix available according to the Honda Dealership. I don't know where you got this fix from but apparently Honda Motor Company has not authorized it for their dealerships to use as a fix.
My car is still under warranty so I am not going to make a repair to it other than what the Honda Dealership makes.
#379 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [mickllogon]
Sep 30, 2009 (12:25 pm)
If you read my post you know what I mean by "blowing hot air". The 2009 Honda Fit Sport blows hot air on you when the AC in on. Recirculation helps only if the car has cooled off it is not (as noticeable) but still annoying for a new car and unacceptable. Using your scenario, presuming the car has cooled to 45 degrees which is the average range, it does not continue to cool from a stop, it blows recirculated air on you whatever that temperature is. If the car has not cooled or recirculation is not on and the outside temperature is 105 degrees when the AC is on and you accelerate from a stop the car blows the outside ambient air temperature on the occupants. I expect a car's AC to cool constantly like every other car before the Honda Fit. If Honda wants to call this defect some earth shattering news they should disclose it to all buyers of the Fit because it deviates so far from the norm of what AC is as well as consumer expectations.
#380 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [mickllogon]
Sep 30, 2009 (4:16 pm)
The question that you asked included a lengthy statement to the effect that Honda didn't have a fix, and asked if anyone knew of a fix. You didn't specify that you wanted a Honda-approved fix--since you'd already established that one did not exist.
I provided a link to a thread on another forum--and the first post in that thread specifically states that the fix is not a factory or dealer fix, and that the originator (not me) disclaims any damage that you might do to your system by implementing it. Maybe you didn't read that part?
In addition to the originator's disclaimer, I also pointed out that it was not a factory fix--and that you should "exhaust all warranty-related options first."
Forgive me for trying to help. You may rest assured it will not happen again.
#381 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [stephen987]
Sep 30, 2009 (7:32 pm)
Your absolutely right. You never mentioned "other websites" other than the one the fix was located on. You seem to want to play sematics, etc. more so than fix the problem. If you can not understand that the car is under warranty and attempting to fix it myself or have anyone else other than an authorized dealer work on the vehicle will void the warranty. That seems fairly straight forward. Actually, let me clarify that for you, the car is one year into it's warranty. It is not like it will be off warranty in a week in which case I would not have a problem trying your fix if it made sense to me. Trying an "unauthorized fix" one year into the warranty and risk voiding the entire warranty makes no sense to me whatsoever.
#382 of 537 Re: Weak A/C? [mickllogon]
Sep 30, 2009 (8:28 pm)
. . . which is precisely why I said that you should exhaust all warranty-related possibilities before attempting this obviously underground fix.
Once again: I offered a fix that I had seen on another website (www.fitfreak.net). You claimed not to be able to find it. I then sent you a direct link to the discussion on that website, on the assumption that since you had asked for a fix and hadn't gotten one from Honda, you might find the information useful. Of course you were certainly free to disregard it if you did not think it was appropriate for your situation--which both I and the originator of that fix made clear.
I gather that you have chosen not to perform this modification because it would void your warranty. That's fine. But don't come back here and bitch at me because the help I offered wasn't what you had in mind.
Over and out. Happy trolling.