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Will the Chevy Volt Succeed?

544 messages,  Last post on Oct 28, 2009 at 1:11 PM

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What is this discussion about? Chevrolet Volt, Automotive News, Hybrid Cars, Coupe, Hatchback, Truck, Sedan, SUV


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#465 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [michael2003] by gfr1
Jul 15, 2009 (7:41 pm)
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Replying to: michael2003 (Jul 15, 2009 6:00 am)

It sounds like you may have not read where GM has changed their philosophy while designing the Volt. It was to let the battery deplete and then crank the ICE for power to recharge the batteries. But, some time ago, they decided to let the battery run down to min voltage and then crank up the engine for motive power only!. This, I guess, will give the driver the incentive/requirement to minimize the ICE use and maximize the EV batt. only mode. I suppose that would maximize the EPA values, for advertisement and corporate mileage. But, I guess if you then have to go up a grade (think about taking an interstate out of LA, northbound!), it will likely be a 25 mph ride, sounding like a gas powered lawnmower, for an hour, or so! Also, it was originally thought to be a 500 total mile vehicle (per tank). Then it was to be a 400 mile vehicle. Now, I guess it probably won't be a 300 mile vehicle. I think the only in-motion battery regen. will be braking regen, and maybe for cost reduction, that might not happen either. -- GFR
#466 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [gfr1] by dmathews3
Jul 16, 2009 (4:12 am)
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Replying to: gfr1 (Jul 15, 2009 7:41 pm)

In other words it is going to be like everyone is saying a joke just like their first electric car.
#467 of 544
Link to Volt website by michael2003
Jul 16, 2009 (4:39 am)
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http://chevroletvoltage.com/
 
Here's another location to gain some insight on what's happening.
#468 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [gfr1] by michael2003
Jul 16, 2009 (5:27 am)
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Replying to: gfr1 (Jul 15, 2009 7:41 pm)

I understood that it only takes around 50 hp to maintain highway speed; i'm sure it's a little higher depending on the grade and speed. The engine being planned for the Volt seems to be capable of generating significantly more than 50 hp, meaning (to me anyway) that it should be quite capable of generating sufficient hp to maintain the vehicle at highway speed and still be able to trickle excess energy back to the battery, even at low rpm's.
 
I understand that GM doesn't want to recharge the battery to a significant degree, in order to increase the life-cycle of the batteries. On a long downgrade I would expect that it's possible that the engine would even be able to shut down for a period of time.
 
At higher rpm's the currently planned motor should be capable to generating sufficient energy to handle all reasonable travel conditions. It wouldn't make sense for GM to not follow this plan if they expect the vehicle to have no compromises and be useful as a single vehicle for a family.
 
I found the following link to give a better description of how the engine/battery should work once the battery reaches its depletion point.
 
http://gm-volt.com/2008/08/25/what-happens-in-the-chevy-volt-past-the-customer-d- epletion-point/
#469 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [michael2003] by gfr1
Jul 16, 2009 (7:55 pm)
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Replying to: michael2003 (Jul 16, 2009 5:27 am)

You may have missed the point. My comment about the changes in regen. philosophy makes your article reference obsolete, because they've decided they want a electric vehicle and only want the ICE to get the vehicle home, if necessary, so to speak. No ICE regen. is planned, as of a couple of months ago. This came from an article (might be Popular Science, I don't recall) from the magazine's engineering editor while visiting the GM research facility. It's not what the can do, but what they've decided is the best course for their objectives, whatever they may be. It has nothing to do with the typical battery operating range of 30 to 80% thing. In this case, unless they change their minds again, when the battery gets down to 30%, as an EV, the electrical propulsion is off-line until recharged from a station. Anything can still change, but your reference has been superceded, as it stands now. -- GFR
#470 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [gfr1] by michael2003
Jul 21, 2009 (3:04 am)
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Replying to: gfr1 (Jul 16, 2009 7:55 pm)

Please provide link to the article you are attempting to reference. From what I can tell, the electrical propusion is not off-line at any time.
#471 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [michael2003] by dmathews3
Jul 21, 2009 (5:25 am)
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Replying to: michael2003 (Jul 21, 2009 3:04 am)

Everything I have read and seen on TV is the electric engine is the ONLY thing that propels the car. The gas engine ONLY runs the electric engine and there is no way it can propel the car itself.
#472 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [dmathews3] by larsb
Jul 21, 2009 (8:31 am)
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Replying to: dmathews3 (Jul 21, 2009 5:25 am)

dmathews3 says, "Everything I have read and seen on TV is the electric engine is the ONLY thing that propels the car. The gas engine ONLY runs the electric engine and there is no way it can propel the car itself. "
 
That is absolutely correct.
#473 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [larsb] by dmathews3
Jul 21, 2009 (10:24 am)
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Replying to: larsb (Jul 21, 2009 8:31 am)

Wow I'm going to have to save this and show my wife, she thinks I'm never right.
#474 of 544
Re: Should GM take note? [dmathews3] by larsb
Jul 21, 2009 (10:32 am)
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Replying to: dmathews3 (Jul 21, 2009 10:24 am)

From a GM press release:
 
(Editor’s Note: This is applicable for North America)
 
The Chevrolet Volt is an Extended-Range Electric Vehicle. It uses Voltec - GM’s electric propulsion system - to drive the car at all times and speeds. The Voltec electric propulsion system is made up of a 16-kWh battery, an electric drive unit, and a four-cylinder engine generator of electricity. Voltec enables up to 40 miles of gas- and emissions-free electric driving with extended-range capability of more than 300 miles.
 
The Chevrolet Volt uses electricity as its primary source of energy to drive the car. There are two modes of operation – Electric and Extended-Range. In both modes, the Volt is propelled by an electric drive unit. The electric drive unit converts electrical energy into mechanical energy to drive the front wheels. It also delivers instant torque, the equivalent of 150 horsepower and a top speed of 100 mph. There is no compromise in vehicle performance in either mode of operation.
 
Electric Mode:
In Electric mode, the Volt will not use gasoline or produce tailpipe emissions. During this primary mode, the Volt is powered by electrical energy stored in its T-shaped lithium-ion battery. The Volt can operate in this mode for up to 40 miles until the battery has reached a low energy level.
 
Extended-Range Mode:
When the battery’s energy is depleted, the Volt seamlessly switches to Extended-Range mode. In this secondary mode, electricity needed to power the vehicle is created on-board by a flex-fuel powered engine-generator. This mode of operation extends the total range of the Volt for hundreds of additional miles, until the vehicle can be refueled or plugged in to recharge the battery.
 
The engine-generator has the capability to provide the level of electrical power that the Volt needs for the most frequent maneuvers. However, the battery will continue to generate some power and work together with the engine-generator to provide peak performance when it's required, such as driving up a steep incline or for high acceleration maneuvers. The engine-generator will then continue to provide electricity to power the vehicle and simultaneously return some energy to the battery to replenish and maintain a low energy level. The battery will not be recharged to a “full” state by the engine-generator.
 
Contrary to a conventional battery-electric vehicle, the extended-range mode eliminates “range anxiety,” giving the confidence and peace of mind that the driver will not be stranded by a depleted battery.
 
Regenerative Braking:
During both modes of operation, energy is captured during braking, converted into electricity and stored in the battery. This process of capturing energy is called regenerative braking. Regenerative braking increases the overall efficiency of the vehicle.
 
Charging:
The Chevrolet Volt can be recharged by plugging its specially designed power cord into a standard household 120V outlet or use 240v for charging. Charging begins automatically. The Volt’s charging technology enables the battery to be charged in less than three hours on a 240v or about eight hours from a 120v outlet. Charge times are reduced if the battery has not been fully depleted. At a cost of about 80 cents per day (10 cents per kWh) for a full charge that will deliver up to 40 miles of electric driving, GM estimates that the Volt will be less expensive to recharge than purchasing a cup of your favorite coffee. Charging the Volt about once daily will consume less electric energy annually than the average home's refrigerator and freezer units.

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