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Sedans Jaguar XF 2009 Jaguar XF
428 messages, Last post on Nov 12, 2009 at 2:43 PM
You are in the Jaguar XF Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
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Replying to: peedy1 (Apr 18, 2008 7:08 pm)
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for better lease rates on the XF you are going to be waiting for a long time. Unless Tata drastically changes the way Land Rover and Jaguar lease their cars then those low lease rates will never happen. The XF leases at about what a 60,000 dollar car should lease out when it is not backed up by 10,000 dollar in various incentives. BMW and Mercedes make more cars in their two American plants then Jaguar sells worldwide. BMW and Mercedes make as many cars in their American plants as Jag/LR sell worldwide combined. How many E class and CLS class mercs does Mercedes sell world wide? I don't know for sure but probably including all the commercial/taxi E-classes sold in Europe the total number must be well over 200,000. Jag just can't compete with that when they sell less then 100,000 cars worldwide.
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Replying to: british_rover (Apr 19, 2008 4:08 am) The fact remains that the XF was an attempt to save the brand and revitalize Jaguar. Purportedly, the XF was to compete with the 5series, Lexus GS, Infiniti M5, Audi A6, etc., i.e. an affordable luxury sedan. Not being competitive in the lease arena will likely hurt Jaguar in the long term. Perhaps not now because they have produced so few of the cars. However, if they are going to increase production, then they are losing a significant market. Perhaps given Tata's resources they will be able to "subsidize" the leases by controlling the residuals. BMW is very successful at this because of the CPO program, i.e. they know that they will be able to sell the car in 2 or 3 years to close to the residual because they are the ones setting the market. It makes great business sense. Although I went with the 535i, I hope that Jaguar is successful. I will want the XK-R in a couple of years (unless I am more successful and jump to the Aston Martin).
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Replying to: random987 (Apr 19, 2008 9:04 am) Look at Land Rover. Horrible reliability and at the bottom of everything. But rich folks still plunk down 80k for a supercharged sport that's about the size of a Ford Escape on the inside. |
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I have been shopping in this market segment. I made a decision recently, but will share a few of my thoughts before I get to that.... Sorry in advance for a very long post, but after reading this thread, I felt compelled to share my thoughts on many of these areas... I think some people are perpetuating false myths about Jaguar build quality and reliability. I am the former owner of two recent XJRs. My 2005 XJR had no service issues besides 10,000 mile servicing intervals. The re-perpetuation of the myth that Jaguars are still problematic with electrical issues etc., is not current reality. The electrical issues go back to Lucas electrical components, and most were pre Ford. Meanwhile, I have two family members with recent BMWs, which had many more shop days than my Jaguar. And, my neighbor has a 2005 E Class Mercedes which is seemingly in the shop every other month. I can also attest to a business associate's problems with his 2006 Audi A-8. These are just anecdotes, but painting today's Jaguars as more problematic than the competition seems off base in my experience. The sale of the company was a bit of an issue to me for a while...I was on the fence about the sale of the company to Tata, but after reading about Tata and understanding their stated commitment to the Jaguar and Range Rover brands, I think it will be a good thing. They are in-action to make this work and... they have money to invest..unlike Ford! Meanwhile, I drove the various XFs on several test drives, while doing my shopping, along with BMWs, Mercedes, Audi, and Lexus cars. They are all very nice cars in their own ways. However, I came to an early conclusion that that the XF is more exciting and interesting than most of them for me..... The basic and luxury versions do seem more comfort oriented than the BMW 5 Series with Sport options, but for blended city and road time, I find the XF to have a great balance between comfort and handling. The Supercharged XF with its suspension settings and 20" wheels is pretty damn satisfying as a road car and I think its dynamics are as good or better than the competition. Furthermore, at a list of $63,000 the XF Supercharged is a huge value, and it is no contest with others in this price range, . As the owner of other Supercharged Jaguars, I do not get the previous comments on this thread about lag either. Once you know how to punch a Supercharged Jaguar you will not find yourself lagging. You can engage the Supercharger at will, or keep things under control with ease. It is about your foot pressure and the adaptive tranny reading your input. The upcoming R version is a totally different story, and it will have more than 500 horsepower and a bunch of performance upgrades...It will also be $75,000 or so, from what I have heard. Those waiting for this car will find themselves reaching much deeper into their pockets... I think that the XF is priced right. If you are buying one, it is a huge value compared with the other cars in its class based on content and build quality.. However, the one area that is a problem right now is the lack of lease programs..which sucks. There are none for the XF. Meanwhile, other brands, including BMW, Mercedes, and Lexus are supporting their cars with lease programs. For business leasers, such as myself, it is very frustrating that Jaguar does not have any programs. The programs for other Jaguars are also very limited right now. It is as if Ford/Jaguar Credit does not want to put themselves out there on these cars at this time. Maybe when Tata takes over it will change. Despite my reservations about the lease deals, at the the end of the day I still took the plunge and leased a XF Luxury Premium with full options, including Bowers & Wilkins sound. My dealer did give me a great deal, well below sticker price (due to my status as a previous loyal customer) and I leased through the best available bank source rather than Jaguar. The lease deal cannot compete with the subsidized programs of other brands, but I can live with it because I like the car. However, I did not take the jump to another Supercharged Jaguar. I could not justify doing a deal on the Supercharged version since the lease rate seemingly jumped about $200 per month on that option due to different residualization and the dealer's reluctance to give me the same level of discount due to shortage of inventory. I could not see spending more on a monthly basis for a $63,000 car than I did for my $80,000+ XJR. I find the car to be very responsive in normal driving and have not really missed the Supercharger yet...although gas prices might have something to do with that too! The one thing to bear in mind is that the basic powertrain and responsiveness of the base engine and the Supercharged is similar until you kick in the Supercharger. There is about a 1.1 second difference in 0-60 times between the two powertrains, and I can live with it. The knob and air vent activity may seem like a gimmick, but I like it, and the console is uncluttered. I think it will catch on. The paddle shifters are great, especially when compared to the former Jaguar J shifter... The car's stereo, audio interface and blue tooth is also really good and intuitive...much improved from what I lived with in my XJR. So far, so good, but I have only had the XF for a couple of days so I will see how it all turns out
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Replying to: donfenn (Apr 23, 2008 2:10 pm) |
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I currently own an 07 LR3 HSE on a 39 month lease. I was at my local Jaguar Land Rover dealer recently to pick up my LR3 from the body shop (I got backed into by a snow plow  ) While I waited for my LR I sat in the XF Supercharged that was in the show room and...well it was love at first sight. I cam back a few days later with my wife for a test drive. I drove the XF Luxury and I was impressed. I plan to test drive the Supercharged soon  I am toying with the idea of ending my LR3 lease early to switch. I still love my LR3 and my ownership experience has been trouble free and very satisfying. In fact if it wasn't for the fact that gas prices are climbing so fast, I was fully planning on upgrading to a Range Rover Sport HSE  I have been reading as much stuff as I can on the XF and I am impressed. All I have to do now is convinced my wife to lease another SUV  Can't hardly wait to get my hands on one |
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Replying to: morocco2 (Apr 25, 2008 11:16 am) That made me think of an interesting idea. Land Rover has done very well over the past three to four years and Jaguar as everyone knows has not. With Land Rover and Jaguar integrated together more then ever before they should try and cross promote more. There are thousands of satisfied Land Rover owners out there who have been experiencing a lot of Jaguar technology in their Land Rovers without even knowing it. I bet if they were offered some owner loyalty incentives and/or some other type of marketing push to look at a new Jaguar they would do it for sure. I am going to flush this idea out a little more then email it to some people see if it gets any traction. |
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Replying to: mentir (Apr 10, 2008 12:53 pm) I think the XF looks beautiful and I’m sure it will be great to drive when it’s not in the shop. Unfortunately, I think the likelihood of their NOT being a ton of bugs in the first year production run of the XF is roughly equal to the odds of gravity failing on planet earth. So, great looking as it is, I just ordered a 535xi.
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