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#33 of 82 Re: In Phoenix [guss]
Aug 27, 2007 (7:50 am)
guss: I did not know that all taxes collected needed to go back to the people that paid them. I know all the senior citizens in my state will be disappointed when the lottery money has to go back to gamblers for new casinos.
Gasoline taxes are user fees designed to make the user pay for both the benefits being offered by the project (better roads make it easier to drive a vehicle) and the wear and tear caused by that use.
As per the federal transportation act, gasoline taxes and other vehicle user fees that go into the Highway Trust Fund are being diverted to other non-road projects, such as bike paths.
Given that current levels of revenue do not appear to be sufficient to maintain our roads and bridges, it is reasonable to ask whether diverting some funds for bike paths is the best possible use of those revenues, and whether bicyclists should perhaps pay at least something to maintain bike paths.
guss: Saying that bikes and bike paths are good is kind of like saying mean people suck.
It's isn't that bike paths are bad. (They aren't). I've used them myself. The question is who should pay for them, and whether we should divert funds from roads and bridges that are in dire need of maintenance to build them.
guss: It goes with out saying that the are better for the environment than cars and certainly better for your health.
I belong to a gym, which I use to maintain my health (which will reduce health care costs) and keep off excess weight (which will improve America, by preventing one more pot belly from marring the visual landscape).
My gym membership, therefore, is a public benefit.
Please list your address, so that I can send you the monthly bill for my gym membership. Keeping in mind the same spirit that you use to advocate taxing all drivers for bike paths, I'm sure that you will be happy to help America by making a monthly contribution to my gym membership fees.
#34 of 82 I guess
Aug 27, 2007 (11:19 am)
the argument is then that while bike paths are good we don't want the money coming from the highway fund. I would be fine with it coming from the general fund. It makes no difference to me where it come from, but if you say the government should not be in the bike path building business I would have a problem with that.
I know the rationale for using gas tax money for paths is that they should relieve congestion on surface streets thus saving the need for additional roads. Whether this is effective or not I do not know. I do know a fair amount of people that actually commute by bike instead of using their car. I guess the real issue is how do we make them pay their share for using the bike paths and lanes.
I am sure if you go to any of the biking forums you will get the other side of the issue ; "Iraq war, should bicyclists pay for it." But I am sure neither one of us wants to go down that road.
BTW, since you work for the State of Pa , aren't I paying for your gym membership already?
#35 of 82 Re: I guess [guss]
Aug 27, 2007 (12:41 pm)
guss: I would be fine with it coming from the general fund. It makes no difference to me where it come from, but if you say the government should not be in the bike path building business I would have a problem with that.
Perhaps a modest tax could be assessed on each new bicycle purchased, with the resulting revenue channeled directly to the Bicycle Path Trust Fund. Bicycle paths would thus be ensured a steadier stream of revenue.
guss: I am sure if you go to any of the biking forums you will get the other side of the issue ; "Iraq war, should bicyclists pay for it." But I am sure neither one of us wants to go down that road.
That's a different issue entirely. With bike paths, we are talking about diverting revenues from the Highway Trust Fund - which is already short of money and was originally set up to fund road and bridge projects - to pay for non-road projects.
It is my understanding that the Iraq war, like all defense spending, comes out of the general fund. EVERYONE - not just bicyclists - is paying for it.
guss: BTW, since you work for the State of Pa , aren't I paying for your gym membership already?
I want a direct incentive.
#36 of 82 A modest
Aug 27, 2007 (5:32 pm)
tax on each bike sold is something I could live with. But we both know that will never come close to funding bike paths.No one should have a free ride , literally. But bikes last so much longer than cars . Heck, I'm still riding the same bike I bought in 1976 with my grass cutting money.
Maybe we need to register and inspect them every year. I can see it now , the Department of Bicycles, Scooters and Roller blades.
#37 of 82 Re: A modest [guss]
Aug 28, 2007 (7:41 am)
Quite a few bicyclists I know do trade up regularly for the "latest and greatest." They follow developments in bicycles as eagerly as some people follow developments in new cars.
#38 of 82 Re: Bicycle paths, should motorists pay for them? [0patience]
Aug 31, 2007 (12:07 pm)
i don't think it costs that much more for bicycle paths. think of it like college sports. ncaa football and basketball are the big money makers. does the football program get all that money, no....the money is split within the school to fund other programs.
i'd rather crooked politicians not get my tax money instead of cyclists.
Nov 27, 2007 (8:12 pm)
We had a thread over in the $4 a Gallon Gas discussion about who pays for the roads and whether they are subsidized (and if so, too much so?).
So this discussion is being tweaked from paying for bike paths to include all the real and social costs of fuel taxes, road taxes, tolls and general revenue dollars used to pay for highways.
Please feel free to contribute your experiences outside the US.
#40 of 82 Re: Motorcycle... [tedebear]
Nov 21, 2007 (7:04 pm)
Oh don't get me started on bicyclists, way to many of them think that traffic laws don't apply to them.
#41 of 82 Re: Motorcycle... [snakeweasel]
Nov 21, 2007 (7:30 pm)
Oh man, don't even get me started about drivers who think bicycles are toys that should only be ridden on parking lots.
Bicycles have the same rights to the road as any other vehicle. And, yes, we must obey the same laws. I always signal my turns, stop at all red lights and stop signs and ride as far to the right as I can where a sudden wind gust won't blow me off the road.
I wish I had a dollar for all the infractions and dangerous acts I witness by motor vehicle operators on a daily basis.
#42 of 82 Re: Motorcycle... [tedebear]
Nov 21, 2007 (7:54 pm)
And, yes, we must obey the same laws.
Yet I can count on one hand of a high school shop teacher the number of times I have seen a bicyclist stop at any of the 4 way stop signs around town.
I wish I had a dime for every time I had to hit the brakes because some yahoo blew off the stop sign on the bike path and just flew out into traffic.
And my favorite one was when I came to a complete stop at a four way stop the proceeded to make a left turn and almost hit the moron on the bike that at a high rate of speed just went through the stop sign then had the nerve to yell at me saying "Bicycles have the same right to use the roads". What a chumpolone.