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Congestion Pricing - Are you for or against it? - READ ONLY

79 messages,  Last post on Nov 17, 2012 at 8:14 AM

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Messages Page 7 of 8

#60 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [Mr_Shiftright] by kernick

May 31, 2010 (4:19 pm)

Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (May 30, 2010 7:03 am)
the oil companies should be made to pay for all the environmental costs associated with the selling of their product.
 
They already do pay for as much environmental impact as coal, natural gas, and nuclear energy do. All our main energy sources have environmental impact.
 
That would probably drive up the price of gas to its true value in the USA, and by doing so, encourage mass transit development.
 
And what would replace the $40B that Exxon-Mobil alone pays the feds in taxes each year/ And take away all the other income and dividend taxes that the owners of oil companies pay. Mass transit AFAIK is a money loser most everywhere.
 
I'm all for mass transit, and natural-gas replacing heating oil to heta my house. But tell me how much it's going to cost to have the bus come up my dead-end road every 1/2 hour in case I want to go somewhere? Tell me why the gas company's gas-line doesn't run tio my city of 20,000, stopping 30 miles short?

#61 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [steve_] by kernick

May 31, 2010 (4:24 pm)

Replying to: steve_ (May 30, 2010 6:10 pm)
As far as terrorism, take out a couple of bridges or a tunnel (or a refinery or two) and you shut down car and traffic and hammer the economy in a flash
 
No you don't. That's been proven when earthquakes or bridge failures have occurred. Personal auto transportation is inconvenienced, but the next day everyone is getting where they are going. Set off a bomb in the NYC subway system 2 days in a row, and the millions that use it would need to be screened, and people would avoid it for months, just like what happened with airports after 9/11.
 
Centralized systems are much more vulnerable, then decentralized.

#62 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [kernick] by steve_ HOST

May 31, 2010 (4:56 pm)

Replying to: kernick (May 31, 2010 4:24 pm)
There's only 12 bridges and tunnels serving Manhattan. I don't think the ferries could handle it if the George Washington was knocked out of service for a while - well, there's no car ferries there anyway, right? Big economic impact. Be more room for the buses and cabs on the surface streets though.

#63 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [steve_] by fintail

May 31, 2010 (6:09 pm)

Replying to: steve_ (May 31, 2010 1:19 pm)
So in sum, the British, in their quest for the ultimate Orwellian nanny state, have embarked on a gigantic congestion charge crusade and have reached inconclusive results. Seeing how well they manage the rest of that old island, I see no reason why we shouldn't jump in feet first and mimic them 100%!
 
I can't say I am sold on it. Let's see that proponent stake everything he owns on his spreadsheets. The cost of the plan is high, and there should be some level of accountability.

#64 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [dave8697] by fintail

May 31, 2010 (6:10 pm)

Replying to: dave8697 (May 31, 2010 1:45 pm)
Do buses even run out there in podunk?

#65 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [steve_] by kernick

May 31, 2010 (7:08 pm)

Replying to: steve_ (May 31, 2010 4:56 pm)
I don't go thru NYC when I can help it, though I do use I-95 and the GW a couple of times each year. The Tappan Zee is a better alternative many times when you don't want to go TO the city, but merely get by NYC.
 
The reason I avoid NYC is because the whole area is nothing but a toll-zone. And those tolls for the most part are the cause of much of the backup. I have sat for 1+ hr on the NJ Turnpike, creeping along, all for the great privilege of paying a $5 (or is it $7 now?) toll. I have paid the toll and then found there really is no other backup other than what the tollbooth has caused! So they create a backup, and make you pay for the "treat" of having to sit in their self-induced backup! Want to know my opinion - take down every toll booth in this country, and get all the toll workers off the payroll or do something that is productive for society. Tolls and the backups they cause are one of the main problems of traffic in NYC.
 
Anyone who's driven the GS Parkway will tell you that yes they get congested and where does the road get congested? Mainly at the toll booths.
 
We used to get 1 mile+ backups here on I-95 at the Hampton Tolls on summer weekends. Well guess what - the tolls were cancelled today and there were no backups.
 
Take down the toll-booths and you'd find traffic flows much better.

#66 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [kernick] by steve_ HOST

May 31, 2010 (7:45 pm)

Replying to: kernick (May 31, 2010 7:08 pm)
Not a lot of people working on the holiday though.
 
I love visiting NYC but I park an hour away if I'm in a car and train in. With the tolls and the parking rates, and the ease of getting around on the bus and subway, you have to wonder why there's any private car congestion.

#67 of 79 cabs by tomcatt630

Jun 01, 2010 (1:13 pm)

In Chicago, we have a lot of young 'new urbanists' moving in and 'giving up their cars'. However, to them, "public transportation" is hailing a cab!
 
We have more cabs than ever, so these pampered yuppies can go bar hopping after work and get drunk. {Also have party limo SUV's} This defeats the purpose of 'green cities'.
 
They should charge more for cabs/limos clogging the streets.

#68 of 79 Re: cabs [tomcatt630] by steve_ HOST

Jun 01, 2010 (2:47 pm)

Replying to: tomcatt630 (Jun 01, 2010 1:13 pm)
I should clarify that by NYC I mean Manhattan. Haven't spent enough time in the boroughs.
 
We were in Chicago just about a year ago. Parked the rental car for free on the street at the B&B in Andersonville and didn't drive it again for 4 days. Didn't hail any cabs but we didn't go and get tanked at Lollapalooza either. We did get serenaded on the L by a lot of college age kids who did partake of the refreshments.

#69 of 79 Re: free bus rides are back [kernick] by Mr_Shiftright HOST

Jun 01, 2010 (4:20 pm)

Replying to: kernick (May 31, 2010 4:19 pm)
It's not $40B---more like $15B in US taxes, (includes sales tax). Most of Exxon's tax payments go overseas. They are heavily divested offshore.

Messages Page 7 of 8

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