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Sedans Nissan Altima Nissan Altima vs Hyundai Sonata
48 messages, Last post on Jun 27, 2008 at 2:37 PM
You are in the Nissan Altima Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
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Replying to: caaz (Jul 25, 2007 1:03 pm) 
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Replying to: macakava (Jul 25, 2007 11:25 am) Renault has nothing to do with how nissan builds, designs, or sells its cars. renault doesn't own nissan. The just purchased a large stake in the company, and as a result, recieve a very fat check every quater........like every other shareholder. they build their own vehicles in separate factories and compete against each other in most countries, the US being the one of the few that they don't. as someone else said, every manufacture has its lemons, and an online message board is hardly an indicator of vehicle reliability. the best indication of the quality of any car is in its resale value. Car "A" will not resell for more than car "B" for no reason. cars that are built better and last longer resell for more $$.
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Replying to: jd10013 (Jul 28, 2007 4:24 am) It would be rather naive to think that the two organizations would not work to consolidate ideas, cultures, resources, supply chain in the spirit of cost reduction. Corporations are forced to operate that way. The best measurement of car quality is in the number of defects per vehicle(such as warranty repairs) over a period of time. Resale is what is perceived/acceped as its market value by the buying public at the time. When gas was cheap, big SUVs had high resale value; today they are a dime a dozen.
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Replying to: macakava (Jul 28, 2007 4:31 am) It wasn't a huge amount of money, at least in the automotive world. and they did exert influence in that they fired all the top management. that was nissan's problem. good company, quality product, but horrendously managed. renault bought into them as an investment, and and, anytime you buy into a troubled company finacial danger is quite possible. but they never have, and don't now, tell nissan how to build their cars. they simply bought in, brought in a new ceo and management team, then sat back and collected their share of the profits. we could argue resale all day. but the bottom line is, if nissan vehicles were such (french inspired) pieces of crap, they wouldn't hold their value as well as they do. 7 people on a message board who had problems doesn't realy mean much. I've owned three nissan vehicles, and between the 3, over 375k miles and 17 years, I might have spent 2k in repair bills. but that too, doesn't really mean much. how a car holds up is determined by a lot of things. how well its maintained, and how its driven can make even the most reliable car look like junk.
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Replying to: jd10013 (Jul 28, 2007 5:08 am) Another factor is the delivered price. Last year, I purchased a new 2006 Hyundai Sonata LX V6 (the predecessor trim to the current Limited) for a price of $17,600, plus tax, title, and license. When you pay considerably less than MSRP to begin with, increased depreciation is again somewhat nullified. It's only a matter of time until Hyundai's resale value improves, as they are building excellent products today. My brother has a 2006 Elantra, and it's never been to the dealer for any warranty work whatsoever. So, the 10 year power train warranty, and 5 year bumper-to-bumper warranty, are just icing on the cake for him. Personally, I really like the looks of the new Altima, but would shy away from the first year of a new generation. My Hyundai dealer treats me exceptionally well. It's the best experience I've ever had, both from a sales and routine service point of view. And, I've owned Honda, Toyota, Nissan, SAAB, and Volvo cars before with various extremes of dealer experiences. One other thing - as to the length of warranty offered by a manufacturer. As one who has worked in management for an electronics manufacturer, I can state that the length of a warranty is not determined by how much warranty work is expected or projected over that time period, actually the opposite is true. A manufacturer that offers a long warranty feels that the product is built so well, that the warranty WILL NOT be needed. It's simply used as a marketing tool. If the converse was true, manufacturers who offer long-term warranties would suffer extraordinary expenses and costs which would ultimately bankrupt them. |
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Replying to: jd10013 (Jul 28, 2007 5:08 am) Financially troubled organizations need to be led by influencial leaders for a successfull turnaround - these involve changes from the leading organization in all aspects of the business. Unless you have a blind organization leading another blind one, i.e. Sears and K-Mart. IHOP and Applebees are shaping up to be the same... Like Colloquor, I keep my cars at least 10 years after which trade-in value is of insignificant concern. My latest trade-in was my 13 yr old Continental. The best warranty is one that you never use. The legal liability of a longer warranty like Hyundai's 10 yr warranty is very expensive to the manufacturer - so it has to have high confidence that their product is so reliable that their repair costs over the 10 years is tolerable. Since I keep my cars 10+ yrs, I know that I am covered for the first 10 years.
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Replying to: macakava (Jul 28, 2007 6:07 am) nissan didn't need changes in all aspects of its business. just the management of it. thats why renault made that change. It's not really a matter of debate, you can look it up. the primary thing Ghosn did when he took over was to layoff, close plants, and fix the dealer network. they don't use the same factories, engineers, design teams, engines or other components. never have, and don't now. with the sole exception of one platform (gblobal B i think its called) that they designed together. And I'm the same way also, don't trade in cars, unless they are at the end of their life, just to get whatever (usually $500 or less) money I can from the dealership. But the point remains, if nissan vehicles were half the pile of junk you make them out to be, they wouldn't hold their value like they do, or continue to increase sales and market share like they do. They would be in the same boat that Ford, GM, and mitsu are in now. |
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Replying to: jd10013 (Jul 28, 2007 6:24 am) I am not saying that all Nissan cars are bad. Our 2006 Maxima SL, one of 5 in the family, is holding up very well. Our 2004 Honda Ody just became 3 yrs old and is holding up better and it never needed any warranty service. Good feedback/indicators about vehicle quality and reliability can be had from many sources like CR,C & D, JDP, etc. The last JD Powers rating was Porsche, Lexus, Hyundai, Toyota, Honda in that order. Honda and Toyota have the highest resale value of Japanese cars for those so interested. It took the Japanese 50+ yrs to get to where their quality is today; the Koreans took 25 yrs for similar quality. Toyota and Honda stand on their own feet and are not influenced/rescued from extinction by a bigger/stronger body like Nissan was by Renault. Mazda is in a similar predicament with a Ford rescue - another blind leading the blind...Ford parts(engines) used in Mazda vehicles - USA companies are more aggressive in using common parts for cost containment.
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Replying to: macakava (Jul 28, 2007 8:14 am) thats the part you don't seem to get. renault doesn't run, influence, or controol nissan. they run thier own comapany, and its always been that way. that is one of the reasons the renault nissan partnership has been heralded as the best ever in the auto industry. two entirely different companies, two totaly different business cultures, that managed to sucsceed precisly because renault understood those differences and didn't get too involved. what nissan and renualt did is entirely like anything else that had been done before in the automotive business. Its nothing like the ford/mazda arrangement, nothing like the mercedes/chrysler deal, or any other.
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Replying to: jd10013 (Jul 28, 2007 6:24 am) engine with the Renault Megane(not sure of the spelling on that one.) |
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