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Hybrid Vehicles Honda Civic Hybrid Honda Civic Hybrid IMA Problems
180 messages, Last post on Nov 30, 2009 at 6:28 PM
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My 2006 HCH has also had IMA problems. It now has about 71,000 miles. I was very happy with it from June 2006 until the problems started in October 2007 at about 46,000 miles after the IMA warning light came on. The dealership replaced the MCM relay and the battery control unit and did 4 software updates to the computer. Prior to the work the car was averaging 50.5 MPG in 80% highway driving. Since the work the average has dropped to 43.9 MPG in the same type of driving. The dealership always blamed the MPG drop on the replacement tires not being "low rolling resistant". Since that time the car has performed erratically. In July it started to lose the charge on the IMA battery. Finally the dealership acknowledged a problem that American Honda was aware of. The IMA battery was replaced with an experimental battery. Since then, the battery has held the charge better, but the performance is still inconsistent. Here is a summary of what has happened so far: October 12, 2007 I took the car in to the dealership for a safety recall on the brake pedal position switch. The mileage on the car was 46,653. At that time I mentioned some unusual behavior of the car. The IMA battery indicator would drop overnight. The car showed that it was charging the battery under acceleration (when it should be assisting). Sometimes the car would not respond when starting out from a stop – the engine RPMs would go up, but the car did not move immediately. The gas mileage had also begun to drop. Prior to this problem the average gas mileage had been 50.5. Since the problem began the gas mileage has dropped to 43.9. The repair consisted of replacing the 12V starting battery and four software updates of the IMA system. October 29, 2007 the IMA warning light came on. The mileage on the car was 47,744. I took the car immediately to the dealship and they replaced the MCM relay and the battery control unit. January 21, 2008 I took my car in for a major regular scheduled maintenance. The mileage on the car was 52,195. After I picked up the car, I asked to speak to the service manager but he was not in. I mentioned some of my concerns to the service advisor. He asked about the tires and he told me that he has seen that some people's gas mileage has dropped into the 30's when specific tires were not installed. The tires had been replaced August 10, 2007 by Sam’s Club (at 41,626 miles). They are good tires, but apparently not “low rolling resistance” tires. I followed up with an email to the service manager. His reply focused on the tires not being “low rolling resistance” tires. He had just returned from a Honda Conference and apparently one of the things they talked about was customer complaints from Hybrid owners concerning their gas mileage after replacing their tires. Since that time the focus of the problem seemed to be on the tires, although there were other abnormal behaviors of the car. July 7, 2008 I spoke with the service manager about the problem that had gotten more frequent and more severe. The IMA battery was not holding a charge, the performance was degraded, ad the charge/assist indicator was showing that the system was often charging under acceleration and assisting while coasting downhill, which is the opposite of normal operation. July 9, 2008 (mileage 66,298) the car was left with the dealership for service. The shop foreman called the Honda Tech line for more information on how to approach the problem. He informed me that my car would have a new experimental IMA battery installed, one of only five in the US. The battery was installed and the car was returned to me on July 14, 2008. I was asked to observe the performance and report back to them on the car’s performance. July 21, 2008 I received an email from the service manager asking if the new battery has solved the problem. My response was that the battery seemed to be holding its charge better, but the IMA system still seemed erratic. He then asked me to bring the car back in when the shop foremen, who was dealing with the problem, returned from vacation. July 31, 2008 the car was left with the dealership for regular scheduled maintenance and further investigation of the IMA problem – battery not charging properly (68,649 miles). When the car was returned to me, apparently the Honda Tech line response was that Honda is still working on a fix for the issue and that what I am experiencing is a “normal condition at this time” according to the service invoice I received. August 4, 2008 I experienced another battery problem when the battery level dropped very low (2 bars) and the car’s performance was terrible. I notified the service manager by email the same day, but as of today, August 6, 2008, I have not received a response. Unresolved problems include: 1) There is erratic behavior of the charge/assist system. Sometimes the system charges under acceleration when it should assist and it assists when coasting downhill and it should be charging. 2) Sometimes the charge/assist indicator will bounce between charging and assisting, and a noticeable “bump” or “surge” occurs. This happens when the car is accelerating, or sometimes decelerating down a hill when it should be charging. 3) Although the new IMA battery was installed and for a couple of weeks it seemed to hold a charge, the battery has become discharged on one or two occasions since the installation of the new battery. The car then exhibits very degraded performance and poor gas mileage. The battery has never charged the way it did before the first IMA problem. Prior to October 2007 it would often charge fully, sometimes each day. Since the first IMA work in October 2007 it rarely charges fully. 4) Sometimes when driving on level ground or a slight downhill grade, the gas mileage indicator drops all the way down. It stays there for several seconds and then goes back up to a normal level. 5) At times it seems that the engine will race or rev up when I start to accelerate from a stop. The car engine goes to AutoStop when the car stops, but it doesn’t seem to move immediately when it restarts the engine after I take my foot off the brake. This does not happen really frequently, but occasionally. 6) The gas mileage of the vehicle has dropped almost 15% overall. But the gas mileage has also very frequently been inconsistent. At times the MPG is up to the 50 MPG range or more. At other times it is in the 38 – 44 MPG range on the same type of road conditions, same driving patterns, and no AC use on either occasion. I drive the vehicle 30,000 – 33,000 miles per year for work, so I am very familiar with the normal performance and mileage of the car, at least before the problems occurred after the IMA warning light came on in October 2007. I am very frustrated with American Honda for problems that they know about, but offer no real solution. |
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Replying to: lectricman52 (Aug 25, 2008 7:30 am) After a new Honda (expensive) main o2 sensor - that tells the computer how the air/fuel ratio is being maintained - all is back to an incredible NORMAL performance! MPG is also back up 20% or more. |
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Replying to: highmpg (Aug 27, 2008 8:35 am) |
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Replying to: highmpg (Aug 27, 2008 8:35 am) I really appreciate your suggestion about the O2 sensor although it is ridiculous that Honda doesn't follow up instead of you having to fund what seems like a design problem. I love the car when it it is operating like it should  , but if their service doesn't start responding I will seriously put Honda on my "GMC list"! 
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I formulated a 60 page letter, it included complaint, concerns and other issues over this website and greenhybrid.com. I sent it registered mail to my dealership president, president american honda customer service, american honda customer service, president of honda motor co in japan and i made sure to CC. it on the document itself. I have also been filling out the forms that my dealership gave me and faxing them over to american honda tech daily. After recieving my letter the president of my dealership contacted me and wants to set up a meeting with honda engineers to look at my car. The parts and service manager has contacted me and has insisted to american honda on being involved in all conversations. As of right now, the horrid sueprvisor who originally handled my case no longer is with honda, and has switched to acura. I have a new supervisor who is reviewing and collecting all of my information. Currently they are awaiting information from Japan, so it is good I also send my file to Japan. |
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Replying to: highmpg (Aug 27, 2008 8:35 am) Last weekend, the IMA system failed to assist in 87 degree weather. The car was running on the 3 cylinder gas engine only, hence seriously underpowered. I reported this as a safety issue, since it can be dangerous in city or interstate driving when acceleration is needed. I am considering filing a complaint with the NHTSA, NHTSA concerning this serious problem when the IMA fails to engage. I know that someone in California has filed a class action lawsuit over the low gas mileage, but I am more concerned about the safety factor.
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Replying to: lectricman52 (Sep 06, 2008 4:48 am) |
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Hi all, I have an 07 civic hybrid with 17,500 miles, and it looks like I'm hitting some of the same problems. Last week, I started up the car to find the battery gauge at 0 bars, something that's not happened to me before. It took about 10 minutes of normal city driving to get the battery to show any charge at all. Now, the IMA seems to be acting very erratically. I've been driving at 25-30 mph on some city roads around here with over half battery charge, and while coasting, the IMA will be draining enough energy to bring the car to <15 mph within a block. Not only that, but IMA assist seems to be kicking in a lot earlier and a lot more than it should be. |
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I have a 2004 HCH 5 speed that I bought used about 6 months ago. I had about 82K miles and now has 93K miles. My average MPG since purchase is 46.1 and I have been as high as 55 MPG on a tank. Recently my IMA & Check eng light has been on. At first, I could clear the codes and the lights would stay off for 4-5 days. Now, they stay off 1-2 miles. The codes are 1433 and 1600. I have noticed that the battery charge indicator will be showing a good charge but will not assist, then a few minutes later the charge indicator will be extremely low. Its like the indicator is not keeping up with the rate of discharge. Also, when the indicator is showing a good charge the Charge/Assist meter shows slightly charging. At times the Auto shutdown does not work, but there is no rhymn or reason as to why. I have also noticed that when accelerating up hills the assist indicator will go to about 3/4 but almost immediately drops to about 1/4 assist. Any ideas? Any help will be appreciated. |
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Despite my sending letters to Honda Motor in Japan, American Honda, and my dealership to the presidents/CEOs, I am still getting no results. American Honda understands that the battery is overheating and a safety feature being initiated but since this is a normal operating procedure, refuse to fix my car until something more serious results. Currently, if I drive on the highway averaging 60 mph, with no AC and the windows barely cracked I can squeeze out 41mpg. My problem is inconsistent as sometimes on a tank of gas I can average 48mpg and others barely 30mpg. This is a sharp contrast to the 50+ I was getting BEFORE I took it in to the dealership. My dealership has since claimed to help me to resolve the problem but has not returned my phone calls. I am going to a new dealership for my 30k maintenance as is it $388 at the new dealership and $554 at the one that broke my car with their refusal to go any lower on the price than $499. I certainly hope that you all are doing what I have been doing, which is complaining, refusing to give in, and demanding that they send you, IN WRITING, their instructions for you to continue to drive these cars malfunctioning. I fully intend to continue to compile all of this information and send it to every news station I can in the hopes that if nothing else, other people will not be suckered in to buying a car that is sub par from a manufacturer that no longer upholds the standards of the past.
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