Last post on Nov 24, 2013 at 2:06 PM
You are in the Honda Civic Hybrid
What is this discussion about?
Honda Civic, Hybrid Cars, Coupe, Sedan
#1173 of 1530 Re: 2006 civic hybrid [Ogre_GEV]
Oct 18, 2011 (6:39 pm)
You seem to be the most knowledgeable poster here, so i direct this to you.
I am the original owner of a 2007 HCH. My total average MPG (as displayed on the dashboard, aggregate since incept, is 50.9). This display is always conservative compared to my calculations. Every tankful I average between 52.0 and 55.0 MPG. I drive in the 2nd lane from the right on Los Angeles freeways, 25 miles each way to work and back, 5 days a week. I get 500+ miles on a tankful. My total average calculated MPG since incept is greater than 52.4 MPG. I also drive a maximum of 39MPH on surface streets, and 58MPH on freeways. I accelerate gently and decelerate with an eye towards battery charging. My vehicle has never been serviced by anyone but a single reliable (though pricey) Honda Dealer, and I have declined to have the IMA firmware update performed, which was offered about a year or two ago, which is my prerogative. I just crested 60K miles a few days ago. My MPG blows away the numbers reported by friends and family who own Priuses. This makes me smile.
This morning the IMA warning light came on for the first time. The car exhibited no ill effects, but I drove it straight to the dealer. The IMA is covered by a 150K mile warranty. After investigating, the dealer announced that the IMA battery pack must be replaced, AND in doing so I could no longer opt out of the firmware update. I asked if there was an upgrade pathway that would get my battery pack replaced with the LiIon batteries of the 2012 HCH, instead of the old tech NimH batteries (which were clearly inferior). Nope, same for same, Fine, I tried.
Now on to my question. So, what can I now expect in the way of changes in performance? It is my understanding that the firmware update essentially alters the algorithm for charging and dialing in/out the IMA, so that the weighting is more toward preserving the NiMH batteries, than maintaining better gas mileage. With my rather sedate driving habits, will I even be affected? I have seen some people post that they saw a dramatic 10% to 20% reduction in fuel economy, but many also posted that they drive much faster, and more aggressively.
I guess I will find out for myself tomorrow when I get my car back from the dealer, but I just wondered if anyone here has had a similar experience.
Thanks in advance!
#1174 of 1530 Re: 2006 civic hybrid [ehybrid]
Oct 18, 2011 (6:47 pm)
With a fresh battery, you should be fine. I lost 1-2 MPG only because my battery is on its last leg. I get no assist out of it for the first 5-10 minutes every morning since the upgrade because it is re-calibrating. At those speeds and on flat surfaces, your on the engine alone anyway.
#1175 of 1530 Re: Still not happy, but... [slider162]
Oct 18, 2011 (6:53 pm)
Taking the car in one last time tomorrow. They had it Saturday but I'm sure the techs didn't know what they were looking for and said there was nothing wrong with it. Now that the techs have seen my video, I hope to get some results.
#1176 of 1530 Re: 2006 civic hybrid [ehybrid]
Oct 18, 2011 (7:03 pm)
Time will tell, but with your driving patterns, I don't think you'll see any change. You may even see an improvement due to the prior losses imposed by the old failing battery. Please let us know how it does.
#1177 of 1530 Re: 2006 civic hybrid [ehybrid]
Oct 19, 2011 (7:16 am)
Based on your driving behavior I think you will do as well as ever. I had the update first and then the battery replacement. The update did not fix my problem, but once the battery was replaced, I was back to my before experienced mileage. I think the less conservative drivers as a general rule get less mileage with the update and a good battery. Good luck. Please let us know how it turns out.
#1178 of 1530 Re: Still not happy, but... [slider162]
Oct 20, 2011 (10:13 am)
I'm doing the happy dance right now! They have agreed to replace my IMA battery.
#1179 of 1530 Re: Still not happy, but... [slider162]
Oct 26, 2011 (6:50 pm)
How did you get them to replace your IMA; I was told I need a new one and it is no longer under warrenty for my 2003 Honda hybrid after 80,000 miles and will cost over $3,000.?
#1180 of 1530 Re: Still not happy, but... [muse50]
Oct 27, 2011 (1:13 am)
Your 2003 Honda Civic Hybrid has an 8 year/ 84,000 mile warranty.
That is 8 years from the in-service date (date originally sold). If you were under the time and mileage when you went to the dealer, you are covered. If you are under the date but over mileage but still under 88,200 miles, (5% over), then Honda will give you a 50% "goodwill" price ($1500), but only if you get upset and complain (it will take a few days as they "consult the regional rep").
If you are beyond those ranges, search the web for a replacement battery that is new or refurbished (a pack straight out of a junkyard will die in 8 months due to cell imbalance), or have yours repaired. Any of these options will save you quite a bit of money.
#1181 of 1530 Re: Still not happy, but... [muse50]
Oct 27, 2011 (5:44 am)
I was well within the warranty period at 67,000 miles. The techs had no idea what I was talking about until they saw the video on YouTube. So making a video was the best thing I could have done. It isn't the easiest thing to explain especially since my car had to sit for at least 8 hours in order to reproduce the issue. Once they saw the video they were able to reproduce the issue twice. I still had to rent a car for three days, but that is a heck of a lot better than the alternative.
#1182 of 1530 2005 Civic Hybrid needs new IMA battery - really?
Oct 27, 2011 (8:25 pm)
Am I crazy or what? I can read the warranty (thanks to many of your posts that caused me to dig a little deeper online and find my registration info on the Honda site). The IMA is covered 10/50,000 but I get told today that I need a new one and it will be $2500!
I wasn't able to do anything except get in the rental car and drive home stunned and wondering how I could have been feeling so great about my car a week ago and now wanting to cut my wrists for being such a 'dumb' buyer to buy a vehicle that will need something so costly so soon. The Service Manager assured me the replacement was fully guaranteed for 3 years/50,000, but all I could think was, 'Great - at 3 years + 1 day or 50,001 miles, I will need another one. Seemed my savings in gas was going to be spent on IMA systems.
Then I began looking online and found a reference to Edmunds and here I am reading so much information about the problem I am having. I will get to the dealer tomorrow morning posthaste to wave the warranty and ask the Service Manager, "What gives?!"
Should I get a second opinion? After discovering the warranty oversight, I'm a little skeptical about the problem as originally presented to me. Also, a little worried that they might 'mess' with something else out of spite. What do you think? Any other suggestions (that are legal, that is)?