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Automotive News & Views Is There Room in the Luxury Market for Hyundai?
4250 messages, Last post on Dec 04, 2009 at 6:46 AM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
if there was room for Toyota and Nissan back in 1989, there is room for Hyundai in 2009.
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Replying to: alman08 (May 13, 2009 6:53 pm) To further the point, I don't think it is a coincidence that the the brand that didn't succeed in the so called luxury market to the same extent as the other two was Infiniti - Nissan not having the same quality rep as the other two at that time. Hyundai has always sold its cars because of the screaming values they tend to be - not because they are perceived to be desireable or special in any way. THAT is what needs to change to 'make room'.
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It's funny to me that when people say a Lexus is a glorified Toyota they mean it as an insult. I doubt a Lexus owner minds that at all - start with a perfectly reliable platform and just make it a lot nicer, especially the interior. Materials quality is far greater, just sit in one. Plus they make powertrain upgrades when appropriate. Look at Toyota's fine 2GR V6. Toyota models make about 266hp yet the Lexus IS with the same block add direct injection and make 306hp. Note that the Lexus ES doesn't get DI, but it's not a sporty model. Porsche took a VW V6 from the Touareg and drops it in the Cayenne and added just 10hp, probably mostly on paper FWIW, and with far simpler changes than adding Direct Injection. Funny thing is Porsche is only getting down to adding DI to their engines now. Yet people give Porsche a pass? Heck, the original VW V6 in the Cayenne only made a measly 250hp. Plus, the whole ignition coil failure affected Audis just as much as it affected VWs. Why do you guys give the Germans a pass when they do the same (or worse)? If 250hp was OK for a Porsche then why is 272hp not OK for a Lexus ES? 
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Replying to: captain2 (May 14, 2009 11:39 am) It has changed. The best example is the Genesis sedan, which won the NACOTY, took 2nd in the MTCOTY (behind a $75k sports car), and is ranked at the top of its class by CR not because it's a "screaming value" (which it is), but because it's a fine car. There are other examples, but not as dramatic, e.g. the Santa Fe being ranked at or near the top of its class of SUVs by CR the past few years, the Elantra ranked as CR's top compact (and even the previous-gen Elantra ranked by Edmunds.com as its best bet for used compacts), and the Veracruz beating out the RX in a head-to-head comparo in MT (albeit price was part of the comparison). Also, when you read professional reviews of Hyundais over the past couple of years, they almost always say something like, "It used to be, people bought Hyundais because they were good values; now they are good cars."
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Replying to: backy (May 14, 2009 3:37 pm) Perception is changing quickly and how!!!! |
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Replying to: lemko (May 13, 2009 10:56 am)  I've owned 3 new VW's and a new Audi, and their quality was horrendous. Never again will I be brand or country loyal. My VW's and Audi had a problem with materials applications. They use plastic where metal should be used, cheap plastic where a more durable plastic should be used, low strength steel where higher strength steel should be used. Things broke that should never have broken. |
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Replying to: captain2 (May 14, 2009 11:39 am) That's what a lot of folks say until they drive one. That changes a lot of minds. Hyundai has moved on from building cheap cars, and astute car buyers recognize it. Yes, they scream value, but not just because they have more size and features for the buck. Their engineering, quality, and styiling are tuning heads, and make them more valuable.
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Replying to: tayl0rd (May 13, 2009 10:48 am) On the fact that the Escalade use mostly Tahoe parts and charge an extra $20,000 for it. And it really shows, fuzzy loose fitting headliner, barely adjustable steering, rear axle where cars in that class should have independents, need I say more? Btw, it's merely an example, it's not dependant on brand name only. Porsche makes great cars, and I find the Cayenne a nice SUV but the v6 version is dumb (why charge that much extra when they simply transplant a VW engine in there?) Slip in what? I don;t care for the brand that much. Lexus shares myriad parts with Toyota doesn't necessarily mean a bad thing. But the fact that it's actually a glorified Toyota didn;t change until very recently when Toyota FINALLY created a separate R&D division for Lexus. Bad car? Not necessarily, but even now I think it's safe to assume that an ES is still a reskinned Camry, no matter how good it is. You seem to miss my point. A rebadge is still a rebadge, good or bad doesn't matter and is not what I'm trying to point out.
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Replying to: bobad (May 14, 2009 7:32 pm) Uh, agree with all the concepts above except for design. The only Korean car that makes my head turn is the Genesis coupe. Want a head turner? I say look at Nissan and Mazda. |
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Replying to: m4d_cow (May 15, 2009 5:01 am) |
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