Last post on Jan 18, 2013 at 7:48 AM
You are in the Jeep Liberty and Jeep Liberty Diesel
What is this discussion about?
Jeep Liberty, Diesel, SUV
#169 of 178 Re: biodiesel in the liberty 2.8 CRD [rgoodspeed]
Jan 11, 2013 (10:35 pm)
Does it do it with speed control on or off? Is the trans in D or is the overdrive off?
there are so many things it could be. U joint that gets some harmonic vibe from the engine, the engine mount as suggested, the turbo engaging at very low rpm in a high gear.
I mention harmonics because when things can vibrate they sometimes get other things to vibrate with them at a certain speed or a rpm. That is why it would occur only under certain conditions.
Wishing you luck with that.
#170 of 178 Be extra vigilant of oil leaks.
Jan 11, 2013 (10:59 pm)
I want to warn everyone. Do not allow any oil leaks to go for even a short period. With changes coming at every 6000 miles and me retired I don't have to do it as often as I used to. Evidently shortly after my last oil change the EGR which had about 100,000 miles on it started malfunctioning. That caused some oil to get pushed out somewhere such that the wind sprayed it all over under the hood. The dealer suggested it was the oil separator which I had replaced about 8,000 miles earlier.
Here is the result. The oil which managed to not drip significantly on the gravel so I could see it caused numerous hoses to be compromised. They have a coating on the inside to protect them from the oil they carry but NOT the outside. If I had needed to crawl underneath I would have seen there was oil leakage but it coated the side of the engine and was not noticeable on my gravel driveway.
The hose that carries pressurized air from the turbo split and I heard air swooshing every time I gave it a bit of throttle. Several of the hoses that are part of emissions were cracked and compromised. The hoses that carry trans fluid were so soft it is a wonder they didn't burst and dump all my trans fluid on the ground.
Mind you, I checked under the hood at about halfway through the 6000 mile mark for the oil change and I did not see that oil leakage. Must have been right after that that things went down hill. It was probably two months that leak was eating away at my hoses and rotting them.
So, at 134,000 miles my Jeep went in to find out what the dickens was the start of the trouble. A new EGR valve, all new hoses to the turbo, new oil separator, new trans fluid lines fluids, and labor cost me $1,400 at the dealer. The EGR alone was $267! They did me right for labor and parts according to what some others are reporting for costs.
Evidently when this starts it starts too small for you to see any drips. But its eating away at all your hoses. So for pete's sake look under there more often if your vehicle has miles on it. In my case it was how long the hoses soaked in the oil. It doesn't take a lot because when I checked the oil it was down only half way between max and min.
#171 of 178 looking for insight
Jan 16, 2013 (2:01 pm)
I have had a few minor troubles with CRD 05. At 75k turbo charger started leaking after a questionable oil change at a local gas station.....so it was replaced. Now 50k miles later it is starting to leak again right after another questionable oil change......big question now is whether to drop another 3000 into yet another turbo charger.......love the ride but. what is reasonable to expect from turbo charger.....a mechanic said the only time he sees this trouble is with wrong oil
#172 of 178 Re: looking for insight [kjoe1]
Jan 16, 2013 (6:39 pm)
A turbo will leak if the seals or the bearings start to go bad. I would think a local machine shop could repair it for you. The last I knew the dealer option was to give core charge for your old one and hit you up for a rebuilt.
Wrong oil might cause a bearing problem with the turbo.
If it was NOT full synthetic it might not be able to take the heat, start breaking down and cause the seals to go or the bearing itself to get wobbly and blow the seal.
Another issue that is very important. If your driving has made the turbo work even a bit hard, the turbo and all its housing and bearings will be HOT. The engine should not be turned off suddenly with a hot turbo. The heat is normally carried away by the normal operation of the engine. Turning the engine off allows heat to build up to even higher temperatures then while pulling hard under load. I'm not saying you ruined the turbo because the wrong oil could definitely do that. I'm saying that the engine should never be turned off suddenly if the turbo is hot.
Around town if you have to accelerate hard to move through traffic even that can be enough to heat the turbo. Idling in traffic counts as cool down time so I always do a mental check on how much idle time in between acceleration there is. I normally park and sit for just a minute or two before turning the engine off. Driving on the interstate I use a second key in the ignition, exit and lock the door with my remote leaving the engine running. You can't manually lock the door with the key in. That way when I need to hit the rest room in a hurry, I can let it idle while I'm inside.
I have used full synthetic oil ever since my first oil change. I usually do it at 6,000 but on occasion it has gone past that mark with no harm done. My Liberty now has 135,000 miles on the original turbo with no problems from the turbo itself. I had an oil leak when the EGR failed and plugged up the oil separator but the turbo is fine.
If the shop put the wrong oil in, you might be able to go back on them, IF you have the receipts. That would show which oil they used based on the price. If you think they charged you for synthetic and gave you standard oil you can send a sample to an analysis center and that will give you a full report on exactly what that oil is. They could be held liable for ignoring procedure. That IS what we pay them for.
Good luck with your problems, hope you figure it out.
#173 of 178 Re: looking for insight [kjoe1]
Jan 16, 2013 (8:57 pm)
Wow the having takin it for even an oil as station change at a questionable local gas station would have been 1 gamble to many already for me. I like bio d man have been lucky that the turbo unit has not needed replacing yet. Have 108 k and just sunk 2k into it for the timing belt and all of the adjoining parts see manual for recomended service at 100 k. So I have it up for bid on ebay and all of these lackies constantly want to get these rigs for under blue book which is already too low, for what it is, does and gets in mpg not to speak of how much it costs to make sure it is handled right in service. Kjeo1 THEE MOST INPORTANT THING IS WHO DOES THE WORK ON THESE RIGS. I am back to taking mine to a worthwhile dealer diesel specialist (not all are). Not only do I like the mechanic but it is becuase they will warranty the work. The jeep is special. I have 2 other non special automobiles and I have found nothing but problems with work done on them. From my small town nice mechanic, to my small town taos barely can speak english mechanic and bigger town BBB rated and referred mechanic to corporate held places like Firestone Pep boys and Midas. Problems pointing to incompetance but the difference is I can file with the AG and get results/$ back with the conglomerates with the small town guys it's oh gee sorry deny deny and that's all. No way there going to put money back in my hand and it is a small town better to tread lighlty and my choices are limited.
Jan 17, 2013 (8:09 am)
hey really appreciate the info. I violated about every one of the suggestions contained in both the responses. I have found a diesel specialty shop and I think although it has 128k on it ....it is worth getting fixed. Great mpg's and great power. I will implement each of the suggestions....costly lessons! BUT THANK YOU
Jan 17, 2013 (12:28 pm)
Before I bought the Libby CRD, I had a 2002 gas powered Libby. I really like the ease of driving and parking, the visibility. But the little bugger never quite got 19mpg on the highway. With city highway it dropped to about 15mpg.
When I learned at a Jeep Camporee the CRD was coming to the US, I knew right then I wanted one. I calculated if it only got 25 mpg and diesel was 40cents higher per gallon, I would still be driving for less then the gas unit. City driving really tears into mpg so don't be too hard on yours if it seems you are not doing well.
It doesn't take much throttle to activate that turbo. I actually think I would prefer to delay the turbo a bit later but I'm not sure if that can be done. When the turbo starts spooling you might not realize it because it comes up gradually. The variable vane turbo is very smooth. Whenever that turbo is working the system has to add fuel to maintain a proper burn so it is like you are feeding six cylinders instead of four.
When the hose from the turbo split I could hear air hissing even at moderate throttle so that turbo is working way before you realize it. That's why she pulls so strong even below 1500rpm with maybe 1/3 throttle. I could hear mine working through that split hose. It would be helpful to install a boost gauge, then you could see when it is working and maybe learn how not to spool it up.
I'm going to ask my diesel tech about the boost gauge and see what he says.
Best of luck to all you folks. Here's hoping you have a great weekend.
#176 of 178 How many miles?
Jan 17, 2013 (1:38 pm)
I purchased this vehicle because the old Mercedes turbo diesels seem to run forever. I understood this was a diesel made for Benz in Italy? So despite the mistakes made with the turbo oil and cooling down before shut off.......I still enjoy the Jeep and even had leather seats put in. How many miles are you experts expecting from your Jeeps???
#177 of 178 Re: How many miles? [kjoe1]
Jan 17, 2013 (3:30 pm)
I was told by the diesel tech with proper oil and sensible driving the engine should go 300,000 before any significant work is needed. Not counting the timing belt and water pump. I had all that done on mine at 120k. The water pump is very important as some aftermarkets will not hold up. There are horror stories on the net about them blowing seals after only 30k. Spend a bit more and get the mopar part.
The transmission is the biggest variable depending on what you pull with it and how often you change fluid. And what fluid you use. Should be good to 200,000 since it is the heavy duty version. They found out early on the torque convertor wasn't tough enough for all that torque so recalls were made on that.
The EGR is demonstrating it is only good for about 100-120K. Mine only cost $270 at the dealer. Don't let them over charge for that and make certain they stick to the manpower hours or they will whack you for labor. If you are slender and a bit agile you can do it at home but it can really try your patience as it is a tight spot.
All the other stuff is about the same as for a gas powered Libby.
Be careful out there and keep on chuggin............
#178 of 178 turbo charger replacement time
Jan 18, 2013 (7:48 am)
I have an estimate of 4 and 1/2 hours replacement time for the turbo unit. does that sound right?