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#31 of 1067 Re: Car Shopping in the US. . . [markcincinnati]
May 25, 2007 (8:23 pm)
I'd say I'm beyond confused, I've made the transition to disappointed
Join the club. The sad truth is the US Government including Congress, EPA and the Administration are not at all interested in using less fossil fuel. Ethanol is a smoke screen and political ploy to keep the farm lobby happy. It takes about as much fossil fuel to grow and produce ethanol as you get back in BTUs. Add those entities to most of the state governments especially the very powerful CA legislature and the lackeys they hire to run CARB and it brings the frustration level even higher. In CA they have held off the environmental wackos in Hollywood with hybrid cars. The real truth is any kind of decrease in fuel usage costs these government agencies TAX DOLLARS. They managed to turn off the EV-1 program that would have cost them billions in lost gas tax revenue.
HERE IT IS BOTTOM LINE. GOVERNMENT DOES NOT WANT TO LOSE ANY TAX DOLLARS. IF WE USE LESS FUEL THEY GET LESS TAXES TO WASTE.
They have managed to keep the status quo for the last 30 years. They are going to keep it flowing at any cost.
#32 of 1067 Ethanol causes all food prices up
May 28, 2007 (10:05 am)
Newpaper today: ethanol not only boosted corn prices 46% over the last several years, it's making farmers plant corn instead of wheat and soybeans, so their prices are going up, too (22% for soybeans). So everything we eat will be going up because of the corporate welfare known as ethanol.
#33 of 1067 Re: Ethanol causes all food prices up [texases]
May 28, 2007 (1:31 pm)
This why I'm saying "NO" to buying GM or Ford. Unless they back off or let go of this ethanol thing, Im looking at buying my first foreign car.
#34 of 1067 Re: Ethanol causes all food prices up [jkinzel]
May 30, 2007 (7:14 pm)
It maybe a fact because ethanol uses organic materials, but is we can minimize the pollution then why not? it's all worthy...
#35 of 1067 Re: Ethanol causes all food prices up [smithjamal]
May 30, 2007 (9:13 pm)
Bio diesel uses organic materials (used cooking oil, animal waste, mostly thing we do not eat) and gets far better mileage. Let use bio diesel instead and eat the corn. Better mileage and a full belly.
#36 of 1067 Using energy to create energy...
May 31, 2007 (9:07 am)
As gagrice pointed out it takes almost as much energy to produce ethanol as it has in the finished product. (This applies to corn ethanol. Sugar cane ethanol can be produced more cheaply.)
I'm not sure why but this kind of government provided wheel turning reminds me of an old joke -
A guy is watching as a government truck is driving along. Every so often the truck would stop. One guy would get out and dig a hole. Then the other guy would get out and fill the hole back in. This continued at regular intervals for some time until the guy finally asks what on earth they are doing. "We're planting trees. Can we help it if the guy that puts the tree in the hole is sick today?"
Ethanol production is a lot like that....
#37 of 1067 Re: Using energy to create energy... [fezo]
by kirstie_h HOST
May 31, 2007 (11:52 am)
This is unverified (by me), but just wondering if others have heard the same -
I was told be a co-worker yesterday that there may be a tequila shortage soon. According to him, agave takes about 8 years to raise properly, so given the (artificial & temporary?) demand for ethanol, Mexican farmworkers are abandoning & destroying agave crop in order to raise corn.
Sounds a bit suspect to me. Suddenly corn is more profitable than agave? Seems like with an 8-year turnaround, it would've been all along.
#38 of 1067 Re: Using energy to create energy... [kirstie_h]
May 31, 2007 (12:00 pm)
Hmmm I don't know. I have seen teh whole mess kicking up a lot of agricultural products as corn prices are guaranteed domestically and now we are growing less what and soybeans because the farm biz would rather grow a guaranteed price crop.
Now I've seen gas prices go up when oil prices go up which is a bit of a lag, but 8 years seems a bit of a stretch.
#39 of 1067 Re: Using energy to create energy... [kirstie_h]
May 31, 2007 (12:03 pm)
Sad but true - read about it here: Agave out, corn in
#40 of 1067 Re: Using energy to create energy... [texases]
by kirstie_h HOST
May 31, 2007 (12:10 pm)
Dang. Guess I'd better start getting my fill of margaritas before the price of tequila goes higher than gas prices (I guess it already is, gallon for gallon, but even I can't drink a gallon). Now that really IS an "inconvenient truth" for me
Interesting... I assumed that the US produced enough corn, or at least has the immediate capability to do so, to satisfy the ethanol-related demand.