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Automotive News & Views Does America Even Need Its Own Automakers?
1788 messages, Last post on Mar 03, 2009 at 2:18 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: lilengineerboy (Feb 27, 2009 6:32 pm) Compared to what? The Fit at 2x the price? Hyundai Accent? Or are you thinking of a 5 year old Civic (which is more likely what I would get at that pricepoint). A 5 year old Civic is a better car than a new Aveo and probably has more life left in it. Wasn't the original Civic hybrid considered a "mild hybrid?" It was less mild and five years ago. There was also the Insight, a real hybrid about 8 years ago. Some other bright points: Chrysler Town & Country/Dodge Caravan, Cadillac CTS, Chevy Malibu (or really any GM car with the 3.6 DI engine), GM's full size SUV hybrids (30% increase in city cycle MPG...if that doesn't matter to you, then you are either all highway or don't need a big SUV) and that is leaving the Dearborn folks completely off this list. Chrysler minivans have poor reliability and don't compete well against Sienna and Odyssey. The Malibu is finally at least in the ballpark - a double, not a home run. Noteworthy only because it doesn't suck like its predecessors. GMs full SUV hybrids are the wrong product at the wrong time. Even at $4/gal they can't earn back their $10K up front cost. |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Feb 27, 2009 3:23 pm) That was weak, spyder. I expected better of you  If anything, having them built by American labor only rubs salt in the wounds of the Big Three. Leaves nobody to blame but the higher ups!
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Feb 28, 2009 12:11 am) .. but the verb was..."...build..." It's still the corporate emphasis. Such vehicles like the Corolla, Civic, Cobalt, Focus all weigh about the same and are composed of about the same amount of materials. They all have about the same amount of direct labor ( not legacy costs ). I don't think we as Americans are any less capable of designing a small vehicle than the Japanese, Koreans, Italians or French. We may even have some creative advantages. But the corporate influences heretofore have pushed the creative and manufacturing talents of the D3 toward building and perfecting larger more profitable vehicles. It's not the workers it's the managers.
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Feb 28, 2009 12:11 am) I have often suspected you were way too optimistic. 
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Feb 28, 2009 11:14 am) One could very carefully assemble a badly designed part, and finish it beautifully, and it would still break.
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Feb 28, 2009 1:23 pm) Excellent small cars can be built in America, if management chooses to do so.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Feb 28, 2009 1:53 pm) Just not by the D3. As long as they carry $1500 to $3000 in legacy costs on each car they will not be able to build them with UAW labor. You cannot add $3000 to an Aveo and sell it. An Escalade maybe. Even a Silverado. Not a small car that will compete with Fit and Yaris. |
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Replying to: gagrice (Feb 28, 2009 2:00 pm) Just not by the D3. As long as they carry $1500 to $3000 in legacy costs on each car they will not be able to build them with UAW labor. You cannot add $3000 to an Aveo and sell it. An Escalade maybe. Even a Silverado. Not a small car that will compete with Fit and Yaris. Ford Fiesta
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Replying to: lilengineerboy (Feb 28, 2009 2:47 pm) Which won't be built in the U.S......
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Replying to: nippononly (Feb 28, 2009 2:57 pm) Only it sounds as if Ford may have another Honda/Toyota-killer on their hands. |
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