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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16738 messages, Last post on Dec 03, 2009 at 10:07 AM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: marsha7 (Feb 27, 2009 8:37 pm) Maybe you should tone it down a bit. Just get back from happy hour? |
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Replying to: tlong (Feb 27, 2009 10:42 am) Thats plain silly since most if not all innovation comes from America. I would tend to agree with Rocky. Yeah the cost would be more, but where does this wholesale of exporting jobs end? Sooner or later we have no one making enough in wages to afford anything import or export. Perhaps much like today. I can ust hear the yelping when other industries are exported as that of the auto/UAW. Lets face it, we just can't be money managers for the world, given the state of affairs in Wall Street. Even the great conservative economics Nobel prize winner Krugman has come down as a buy American, given the current conditions. |
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Replying to: marsha7 (Feb 27, 2009 8:37 pm) The Big 3 are not suffering as a result of the decisions jointly made between any or all of them and the UAW today. They are suffering as a result of decisions made by those entities in the 1950s and 1960s, when the Big 3 could be fairly said to have oligopoly power and could easily pass on these costs to consumers. Once that power was lost, these legacy costs were left over and the Big 3 could never quite figure out a way (until recently) to get out from under them. Assuming we're talking about more competitive industries than 1950-60 Detroit, no new union today would be able to organize, say, Walmart and obtain a defined benefit pension plan or retiree health care benefits. The converse of this rhetorical question would be whether Americans (Democrats or Republicans if there are any left) trust the management teams of the likes of ENRON, Citicorp, AIG, Washington Mutual, et. al. to raise the living standards of the typical American worker without giving that worker some increased bargaining power. One suspects the answer lies somewhere in the middle but the idea that unions are antithetical to economic prosperity is one which would have been controversial prior to around 1980 in the United States.
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Feb 28, 2009 1:45 am) I not sure where this sense of entltlement comes from. In the US we have the right to life,Liberty and the pursuit of happiness; not actual happiness, not economic security, etc. I do agree with many others' comments here, that all that said, the government does not do a great job with leveling the playing field with other foreign sellers. Economic times are tough but we all have the same choices with our jobs: if we don't like it, we look elsewhere. The writing has been on the wall with the big 3 for 20 years: Declining market share and quarterly billion dollar losses. Only the Federal government with a printing press can endure such circumstances.
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Replying to: smithed (Feb 27, 2009 8:52 am) Those were truly days of glory for the big three. The D3 cars were, for the most part, superior to anything coming out of Europe. Many of the European models came with small tool kits to keep them running. "Detroit Iron" was king. I can remember going to Ford in Hapeville Georgia and Chevy at Lakewood,(every September) to check out the new models. Looking through the Chain link fence. Checking out the new body styles. That actually started in late 1954 when we got wind of a totally new 55 Chevy with a V8. WOW. Never owned one of them but my 52 Chevy 4 door sedan got one of those fabulous ( 265 cu in) engines stuffed under the hood in '59.. But then the 60s hit and Detroit got interesting with the HP races. All three made big powerful motors. Way to much engine for the brakes and chassis. But we didn't care. '60 Impala with 4speed and 348 cu in, 62 Catalina with 389 cu in, 63 Impala 4 speed 327, 64 GTO- 4 speed-tri power-389 (favorite), 66 Fairlane 390 GTA, and 67 GTO automatic 400 cu in all graced my drive way, all bought new, with several 4 and 6 cylinder things mixed in for commuting. 49 VW beetle, 61 Corvair, 63 Falcon, 65 Mustang, etc. Then the EPA started working it's magic in the 70s and got serious in the 80s and the D3 began to fall behind in innovations. Especially in the drive train department. If we wanted a car that ran good, we kept what we had. We kept the IRON from the middle 50' through the late 60's and a few mid 70 models. D3 engineers and BEAN COUNTERS, continued to cut corners, UAW continued to demand more, and the Japanese continued to make their products run better and last longer. Yeah, I remember disparaging the "Jap Junk" that were made from left over WW2 GI beer cans, we said. But they kept importing the little pieces of crap and good Americans were actually buying them. Yep, I had a "BUY AMERICAN" bumper sticker on both our 73 Catalina and 73 Chevy Cheyenne Pickup bumpers. Things got tight for us and I had to sell both vehicles. Got a 66 (289 cu in) Cougar for the wife and a new 74 Toyota PU for me. Then I began to understand why the "Jap" cars were so popular. The Toyota never broke. Never had to take it to a dealer for any type of warranty or other work. The 73 Chevy truck had been to the dealer, many times. I didn't "know" the service writers at the Toyota dealership like I did at the Chevy and Pontiac dealerships. Last try at an American "car" was the 87 Olds. Driver seat sagged, Paint peeled, and THE ENGINE AND TRANNY WERE PRETTY MUCH SHOT AT 75K . Last try at an American truck was the 98 Ram. Too many problems! So what happened to DETROIT IRON ? The word GREED comes to mind. Kip |
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Will the UAW rank and file feel betrayed as they loose everything that they gained over the 30 year slide in the USA auto industry? They voted the team in and now there will be no party in Michigan. That's ironic! Regards, OW
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Replying to: kipk (Feb 28, 2009 5:10 am) After a '79 Sunbird and a '91 Continental I gave up! I gots a '91 Accord, a '99 Odyssey, an '05 CR-V and an '07 Element. Fluid and filter changes!!! ........AND they have more US content than did the '91 Continental!!!! (...made in Mexico!) |
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Replying to: kipk (Feb 28, 2009 5:10 am) I bought an 83 Dodge Charger that was good until about 70K miles. I would lose almost all of the power steering fluid on a sharp right turn and remember taking right turns very gently, then pulling over to fill the power steering fluid. I would keep a case of it in the car.
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Replying to: mikefm58 (Feb 28, 2009 5:25 am) Regards, OW |
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