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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16705 messages, Last post on Nov 25, 2009 at 6:56 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Jan 14, 2009 3:52 pm) Absolutely. There are more choices and the major networks have not kept up. While I agree that the Big 3 have largely ignored their CARS (not trucks), the fact is that people have more choices today. Agreed. If you want the best truck buy a D3 vehicle. If you want the best car you need to buy a foreign nameplate. |
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yankabilly, try to think of things this way: 1) if the workers are really skilled enough, they wouldn't get laid off. If they're skilled enough, as soon as they get laid off they'll get another job easily. 2) If the workers are skilled and aren't overpaid, other companies will gladly take them. 3) If they're smart enough they would've boycott UAW rules that force them to join the union. Fact is, most UAW workers are lazy and greedy, wanting the pay but not wanting to do the effort. I detest those kind of people, and they all can drop dead, unemployed for all I care. I worked hard from the bottom and now enjoy the result, payment cuts? never gonna happen to me, not if the company wish to keep one of it's top employees  . Compared to them yes I dare say I'm Superman  *This does NOT mean I blame UAW for our economy or for GM getting screwed. Both GM management and UAW share the guilt for GM's current state. It's not GM's fault the economy is messed, however it's also not the economy's fault Gm gets messed up.
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Agreed. If you want the best truck buy a D3 vehicle. If you want the best car you need to buy a foreign nameplate. Agreed, with slight change: if you want the best small truck buy a Frontier or Tacoma. As for larger trucks, anyone who thinks Nissan Titan is better than F150 or Silverado better get his/her brain checked.
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Replying to: m4d_cow (Jan 15, 2009 2:20 am)
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 13, 2009 11:21 am)
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Replying to: yankabilly (Jan 15, 2009 3:59 am) This is how things work for most of us, why are you surprised. It's the reason you might shop at 1 grocery store over another, haggle over the price of a car or a house, or negotiate your pay. I have no union, work with other engineers who make different amounts, but am content with what I make. How can that be - because the basis of getting paid what you're worth is the ability to say to your current employer - "I don't like my pay and I'm leaving for better pay at Company BCD". If you can't do that then you're either making the maximum you're worth, OR being paid too much, since you can't find other work paying the same. Similarly what a house or car is worth = what someone is willing to pay for it at any given time.
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Replying to: yankabilly (Jan 15, 2009 3:59 am) Your work is a merchandise that was simply worth less than you think it was - just the same as a used car dealer sets their asking price at $10K and agrees on $6K. As you don't want the government to make you pay 10 grand for that used car, somebody else should not be compelled (read coerced) to pay you $12/hr just because you say so. Ultimately, they offered you took it, end of story. All most unions want is package mediocrity and coerce employers to pay for it as it were top notch performance with no option of actual verification (try to fire some union drunk who show up hour late and has to be cleaned after every single time). Pay this guy as he were master of universe just because I say so, or else. No, thanks.
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Replying to: yankabilly (Jan 15, 2009 4:02 am) It was an attempt to get socialized medicine. Envisioned by Harry Truman in 1945 and signed into law by LBJ in 1965. It ended up covering Social Security recipients. It is not free just less expensive than other insurance coverage. I pay $96 per month taken out of my SS. It is mandatory coverage. You also need supplemental coverage which can cost as little as $30 per month and go over several hundred. For those of you keeping count. Out of those 20 years that Congress fought against socialized medicine, the Republicans only controlled the House and the Senate two times. So the Democrats fought against universal health care as much as the Republicans. Same as in 1993-94 when Hillary tried getting it past a Democrat controlled Congress. Here is the big question. Why, if Universal Health Care is SOOO important to the UAW, do they not want their retirees going on Medicare at age 65?
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Replying to: dino001 (Jan 15, 2009 6:04 am) What you have pointed out has killed most of the trade unions in CA. Non-Union contractors come in and underbid the Union contractor for two simple reasons. The Non-Union contractor can change the going rate of pay to match the market without opening a Union contract. They can also weed out the non producers and keep the best workers on payroll. My wife's steel company was Union until her step son took over the business in the early 1990s. That was a bad time for building and he found he had no flexibility to lay off the less productive workers. The bidding became so critical you could not compete as a Union contractor and survive. So he shut down and re-opened as non union. Most of the good workers came to work for him at the same pay & benefits as when they were Union. Just no work rules to deal with. That is what GM needs to do in a bankruptcy. Get rid of the UAW and its 2200 pages of repressive work rules.
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Replying to: kernick (Jan 15, 2009 6:01 am) It is simple supply and demand. Rocky always pointed to my $38 per hour as a reason that a UAW worker should get $30 per hour. That IS pure idiocy. The reason I got what I did was a willingness to work away from home and family. I lived in a 10X12 room for half the year and ate in a cafeteria. It sounds like a great job. We had many people work in the Arctic one shift and not come back. They did not want to leave the wife and kids for 3-6 weeks at a time. If I had quit and gone to work in CA doing the same work, I would have been lucky to get $25 per hour with no pension. If a person thinks they are worth more than they are getting paid. Find someone that will pay that price and quit where you feel underpaid. That is the beauty of a system like ours. Unions can rob us of our individuality by bringing the good producers down to the level of the poor producers. That is where the UAW, AMA, NEA and many Civil Service Unions are right now.
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