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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16635 messages, Last post on Nov 05, 2009 at 4:06 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 11, 2009 4:47 am) So you think that the VAT explains why the BMW is less expensive than the Cadillac? If so, you missed my point. Both the BMW & the comparable Mercedes are considerably more expensive. Cadillac enjoys a significant price advantage over its German competition, & yet it can't translate that into increased sales & profits. In the luxury market segment, perceived status matters much more than price differences, so you can't blame Caddy's problems on how other countries tax their citizens. Caddy's problem, which, by extension, is also a UAW problem, is that far fewer people aspire to own one. You can say that the German brands attract status-seeking badge hounds & you'd be at least partly correct, but I'm old enough to remember when status-seeking badge hounds hungered for Cadillacs & made the Cadillac division a profit monster that was the envy of the entire industry. Why can't Caddy get back some of these shallow people? Their money is just as good as anyone else's. 1. Drop any tariffs, quotas or other special taxes on imported goods and services. 2. Drop any market-distorting practices, like selective subsidies, taxes, regulations or other policies that favor domestic or foreign products or services. 3. Provide free access to accurate information about the markets involved. 4. Allow money and other forms of capitol to flow unrestricted between countries, without currency manipulation or restrictions. 5. Labor must also be able to travel freely within the free-trade region. I'm a hard-core free-trading Cato Institute supporter, so all of these sound good to me. My main brief is with some UAW supporters who say that until all countries adhere to these principles, the U.S. should be as protectionist as the worst of its trading partners. I don't buy that.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 11, 2009 6:11 am) There's a tremendous variation among labor unions-not only among the industries with which they're affiliated, but among the working people comprising their memberships. There's the guy toiling in an iron foundry in Indiana, the guy running a paper machine in Everett, Washington, the woman nurse tending patients in a San Francisco convalescent hospital. And there's George Clooney, Julia Roberts, Derek Jeter, Alex Rodriquez, Kobe Bryant and Tom Brady. What do these folks have in common? They are all dues-paying members of labor unions, organizations dedicated to improving the wages, benefits and working conditions of the American worker. The first three individuals mentioned earn roughly $50,000-$60,000 a year, with decent benefits. The others-the actors and athletes-earn millions. As for the tel com corridor here in Texas In many ways, it's worse. Like the massive declines in the nation's steel, oil and automobile industries in decades past, the disintegration of the telecom business is leaving deep wounds in the U.S. work force. But labor historians say telecom stands out for the unprecedented speed of the boom-and-bust cycle. After telecom was deregulated in 1996, it quickly expanded by some 331,000 jobs before peaking in late 2000. Since the downturn started, though, companies have announced layoffs that have wiped out all those new jobs and more -- a total of well over 500,000 workers, according to a tally by The Wall Street Journal. By contrast, it took two decades for the ranks of the United Auto Workers to fall to 732,000 from 1.5 million, as the auto industry was forced to become much more efficient in the face of foreign competition. http://www.happinessonline.org/InfectiousGreed/p26.htm
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I have not said one word here on this subject except to say that the big 3 have had excellent insurance in the past at a very high cost. This high cost paid for not only the workers but also those who used the services that did not have insurance. Only lately have the insurance companies fought back. Now when I get back the invoice from the insurance company there is the charge by the care provider, a much lower charge of what the insurance company will actually pay and my copay. So if the medical provider wants my business (insurance approved) they can only accept the insurance companies estimate of what it should be. But what I really want to say is how the heck can we afford national health care? My brother no longer has a job with insurance. His family cost would be over $15,000 a year. Since only half the families in this country could ever afford that then the other half would need to pay $24,000 in taxes. I do not know about you but that is a large percentage of our income. My opinion? We start out by providing free health care for all US citizens until they are 18 (and any issues that they had before 18 that continue) and for those over 65. Affordable and fair.
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Replying to: jimbres (Jan 11, 2009 6:18 am) The United States is the leader of the World. We need to lead by example. We need to get the message out that improved lifestyle is a direct result of free trade. It keeps prices competitive and quality is assured. It has been proven so many times throughout history that protectionism creates mediocrity and eventual collapse. GM and the UAW have to work together to gain back the edge they once had. Or they will just go into the history books with the dozens of other automakers. I miss Studebaker and Packard more than I will miss Chevrolet and Dodge. |
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Replying to: jimbres (Jan 11, 2009 6:18 am) Could you even think that the price gap would be even more if it were not for VAT? The CTS V has the recarro seats and a V8 which makes it the Status Car if one is looking for the envy factor. CATO ? Isn't that where old PHDs go to promote think tank ideas which are funded by private interests? Where is the peer review in such institutions? Much like the writers of the old classics, where few women were represented (Emily Dickinson/Harper Lee come to mind) and the good ole boys club came to being. We have to also note that maybe 10% of Americans could read and write. Americans for Democratic Action gets a label slightly less frequently than the Heritage Foundation, though both are labeled very often. In fact, the ADA gets a label more often than the Young Americans for Freedom does, and almost three times as often as conservative groups like the Cato Institute or the National Association of Scholars. And the overall tendency is overwhelming: liberals are singled out for their views more often than conservatives are. Liberal has become such a problematic word that nobody seems to want to use it. Since the Reagan era, the right has gone after it as "the L-word," to the point where a lot of politicians are nervous about owning up to being liberals. And people on the genuine left have always been suspicious of the term, preferring to think of themselves as progressives. But nobody every talks about "the C-word," and people on the right are always happy to call themselves conservatives. Hence, we can go on about the Orwellian lexicon and almost as laughable as the liberal media bias. Just who does own the media? Who advertises/bankrolls on this so called liberal media?
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 11, 2009 6:36 am) As a life long Union person under 3 different Unions, I am not anti union. My problem is with the UAW that is squeezing the life blood out of the Domestic Auto Industry. 400,000 prima donna workers and 700,000 retirees should not be allowed to hold the domestic auto industry hostage. You will never convince me that the auto industry jobs lost are not a direct result of UAW bullheadedness over work rules and benefits. The UAW is as much responsible for the jobs going to Mexico, Brazil and Canada as any one entity. And in spite of that GM was so weighed down here at home that they have not made a decent return on investment for over 20 years. I say that is killing the goose laying the golden egg.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 11, 2009 7:11 am) Thats not up to you and myself. This next generation will send down its list of DEMANDS. If you think they aren't going to change things, think again. Your under estimating their abilities. This isn't China. These are the very kids who are fighting the war as we speak, getting educated, and enjoying the American dream. We could look at those who worked 364 days a year, 12 hours a day, for life's bare needs (food clothing, and shelter) in the steel mills. Its gotten better not worse. Whats next? A 20 hour work week? Its up to them. Your under estimating social forces within a society. I think they will opt for making the UAW stronger. I've seen this whole thing go to the extreme right and now its going the other way, as if it were a law of physics.
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Jan 11, 2009 6:42 am) If patients, physicians and the Medicare Corporation continue to work together, without the deleterious interference of private for-profit health insurance corporations, malpractice threats and overt pharmaceutical marketing, the future for American health care will be healthy indeed.. A continuation of the status-quo mixture of a government subsidized private health maintenance insurance industry operating parallel to and within Medicare is wasteful, and will continue to provide no potential future health improvements for America http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/february/what_government_does.php http://www.americanhealthcarereform.org/ http://www.health-care-reform.net/causedeath.htm |
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 11, 2009 7:48 am) My view is just the opposite. I see us swinging to the extreme left over the last 15 years and am hoping that somewhere there are those that cherish conservative values, that will step up and say enough is enough. The UAW entitlement mentality is the epitome of Liberal think. No different than someone sitting in the ghetto watching a big screen TV, waiting for their welfare check and food stamp allotment. After they get their rent paid under Section 8. You see I have first hand knowledge of what goes on with our system of entitlement. I had a Section 8 renter that did not pay me her part of the rent for over 3 years. She found a bigger house than mine and moved her 5 kids and got me off the hook. When they booted her out in 3 months she called asking to move back in. I thankfully had rented it to a paying renter with a job. This country is so far left now, I do not look for it to ever get back close to fiscal conservatism that I live my life by. Hopefully the members in the UAW will boot fiddlefinger out and give GM and Ford a chance to survive. I think it is too late for GM.
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up what a lot of us think about what the UAW's have done to point the domestic auto industry towards the huge iceberg. Demanding more from your Company than they really can afford to give is one of the big problems here. While the Big 3 decided that cars weren't the meal ticket and that they could just be left out to twist in the wind, it's the UAW with their rather large pay increase demands and healthcare demands that have helped sink GM and Chrysler. It sounds like A.Mullaly and Ford Motor Co. are saying that they'll be all right for 2009, and hopefully after that, if I have read my automotive news right. Their autos seem to be getting built better all the time, though a new all-electric would be nice, Ford. Maybe take the 2010 Ford Fiesta model and rebuild it with an all-electric powertrain, it's light, and would be the most fitting Ford to fit for electricity, at least without showing us any other bodystyles they're currently working on. But that's the point, if GM wants to charge people $40,000+ for the 2010 Chevy Volt, that's not going to mix with this economic situation very well. Think smaller, like the 2010 Pininfarina-Bollore B0, for example, GM, Ford and...umm...Chrysler. 
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