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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16719 messages, Last post on Dec 02, 2009 at 6:09 AM
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Replying to: explorerx4 (Jan 03, 2009 4:47 pm)
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I am retired from the UAW staff and live near the Walter and May Reuther Family Education Center on Black Lake in Northeast Michigan. You can find out about the Center by checking it out on the web.Building started in 1967 and Walter Reuther and his wife May died in a plane crash on a visit to the center in 1970. The public golf course at the Center was opened in 2000. The UAW pays all expenses for a week long education program for rank and file UAW members and their entire families. it has rooms for about 300 guests. Rank and file members apply for a scholarship to Black Lake through their local unions. The current financing mechanism is provided by the interest on the UAW strike fund. I frankly do not understand why anyone questions spending membership funds for a member's family to spend a week of vacation/training at a nice place like Black Lake. What is wrong with that or would you rather have the money spent on strike benefits or UAW staff salaries and benefits? I think these criticisms are generated by antipathy to unions or the working class generally. why should ordinary workers get to stay at a nice place and get a discount to play golf at a first class course? Would anyone even question this if an employer did the same for its salaried employees--as many do? The current worldwide economic difficulties of every auto manufacturer affects their unions but the UAW is not asking for a loan from the federal government to maintain union operations. To those that suggest that the property should be sold, you may want to know that the Michigan real estate market, particularly resort properties is down somewhat. But in any event, that is up to the UAW leadership and membership. I assure you that the appropriations for the building of the Center and its annual costs have been approved by the UAW membership at every UAW convention. The suggestion that pension funds are somehow diverted to pay for any Center operations is not only untrue but laughable. Members of the public are encouraged to play golf as it helps pay the expenses. I find it strange that some quarrel with that. It is a great course and might fetch an even higher fee per round if it was located on the western side of northern michigan where many more expensive courses are located.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 03, 2009 4:57 pm) Sorry Gary, I'm rank and file, held two different offices years ago. Never ran again, too much work on my plate. I found that neither the company or the union are the evil envisioned and thereby disillusioned in my effort to do something noble. I do charity work to fill that void now. I'm trying to atone for all my past transgressions. There is no one as blind as he/she who does not open their eyes and or turn on the light.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 03, 2009 4:57 pm) kind of like the B3 ceo's and airplane travel.
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 03, 2009 10:45 am) I think he got it right here. GM has both a fudiciary and ethical responsibility to both it's union and non union employees to meet its promises as best it can. It has done an excellent job at this and will continue to do so. AND AGAIN, GM HAS abandoned the defined benefit pensions and is only holding the monies to meet it's past promises which is exactly what I think you think is the right thing to do. For information on how this was done recently: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/25/business/25auto.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2 But it has cost GM big time to do this. Perhaps we would have a different world today if they would have abandoned the pension plan 10 years ago and put the billions into their vehicles. Hey, perhaps they could still do this with the hourly pensions THIS year? |
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Replying to: lumoy (Jan 03, 2009 5:32 pm) Do you take advantage of your golf course as a retiree? I think the whole thing came to light when it was revealed that the center had lost $23 million over the last 5 years. While cost for training is part of doing business or it should be. I wonder if it is the golf course that is draining the UAW. From the play records it is obvious that more non UAW members use the course than do members by more than two to one. My main reason in questioning Union expenditures comes from my own Union experience. I watched as Union built a big fancy hospital for the members. Then A large dental clinic and a big office complex. After that a world class recreation center. All those assets were financed with our pension fund. This was all prior to tougher regulations by the Feds. None of the projects made money or any real sense. They were monuments to the Secretary Treasurer Jesse Carr. Now they are all sold and off of our books. Good riddance as they were all a drag with little value to the membership as a whole. Here is what another Teamster recalls from that era: I was a member of the Teamsters, Local 959, and worked as a Teamster during the TAPS project. Anyone who worked as a union member in the Teamsters was fortunate to have Carr serving as secretary-treasurer because he provided incredible benefits to union members like free dental, free vision, free membership at the Alaska Club, free legal services, etc. Why isn't anything named after the great legend, Jesse L. Carr? It's surprising to find no books written documenting the power unions wielded over oilies during the '70s when the Trans-Alaska Pipeline was under construction. Secretary-Treasurer of the Teamsters Local 959, Jesse L. Carr was the most powerful man in Alaska, in the 1970's. Jesse Carr did as much for Alaska labor as Walter Reuther did for the UAW. They are both gone and their legacy has little meaning in the 21st century. The question for every UAW member to think about is will the UAW survive another 10-20 years? With the current caliber of leadership in the UAW it is doubtful. I keep up on our Teamster pension fund as it is my retirement. I don't want any funny business being invested in. No investments made over a round of golf by some guy named Madoff. Trust but verify is the advice I give to anyone expecting or receiving a pension. We are near the last as the whole pension process got corrupted by too much government and unscrupulous Corporate managers & Union leaders. |
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Jan 03, 2009 6:00 pm) I agree with that. I also think they should have dumped the pension system when they had the chance during the 1998 strike. The way I see it is this. GM is currently responsible for a large pension plan. Say it is worth currently $90 billion. The government PBGC says it has to be kept in a certain level of funding or the corporation has to add money to keep it funded. Well is that fair? The company in good faith put money in the pension fund for each employee over the period of years they worked. Now the economy tanks and the banks default on billions of dollars they are holding or should have been holding that were in a pension fund. Now all of a sudden GM or whatever corporation is involved has to put enough money back into that fund to keep it funded at a given level. It seems the corporation takes all the risks and the retiree takes none. With a 401K it is the employee that oversees the fund. They can put it in high risk mutual funds or low interest safe savings. A 401K also passes all that is left following the death of the employee to his heirs. Something many pension plans do not do. If I die tomorrow my wife gets nothing more from my Teamster Pension. Due to the pension cap imposed by the Federal Government we also opted for a 401K and took some of our wage and invested as a supplement. It is good to have more than one income source with the crooks in government & business today. |
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 03, 2009 7:08 pm) I also think they should have dumped the pension system when they had the chance during the 1998 strike. Please recall my comments earlier about the cost of the 2 month strike vs the cost to the union/workers. They shut down the company and could have continued to for many more months. To allow the strike to continue for months would have put GM out of business. GM did not really have a chance to make any of the changes that they would have liked to.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 03, 2009 7:08 pm) So today I have the best of both worlds in my opinion. We have a defined benefit plan when we retire AND we have 401's(which I have been putting into since '85 or so). So today I still have a pension coming yet my 401 is crashed. Hopefully by the time I can start getting my pension and use my 401/IRA's they will both be full of money.
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Replying to: explorerx4 (Jan 03, 2009 5:50 pm) kind of like the B3 ceo's and airplane travel. Exactly! The CEOs flew to Washington on personal jets to beg for our taxpayer money. The union talked up a good line about the poor workers and begged for the same money, while they own a multi-$$million golf course and "training center". No offer of sacrifice, mortgage, or anything else was offered by the union to get the funds. The union would not even agree to have compensation reach parity with competitors until the current contract runs out in future years. They're all living their continuing lifestyle while you, I, and the rest of the American people try to pay our bills on time and live within our means. But our pockets are being picked by the unions and executives who could not run a company like a business that actually had to be competitive and make money.
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